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Defense?
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Tamburlaine Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:13 am Posts: 1859	Re: Defense? Renthrak wrote: The current game balance allows for good defense. It actually does. The problem is that it doesn't happen, because it's incredibly frustrating and almost completely unrewarding. Half a dozen turrets, a couple force fields, mines scattered everywhere, a decent sniper or two watching the area, a HoF with technicians supporting and maybe a Shrike flying around to chase . . . that's going to require a fair portion of the enemy team to break through, while still leaving half of the friendly team to go for the flag. And then an orbital reduces that entire defence to a sentinel and a shrike. _________________ oh god where does this link go how did it get here I am not good with computer
Sun May 13, 2012 4:45 pm

illerFFN Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:52 pm Posts: 1174	Re: Defense? Scratch the Sentinel off too if he was setting up Claymores. As Sent, ... I probably die to Orbitals 3x more often than I do to INF's and FusionMortars Trying to get away from that city-block size Conflagration is impossible, I would need the pathfinder's Thrust pack to achieve that kind of escape velocity.
Sun May 13, 2012 4:59 pm

lawlertron Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2012 8:07 pm Posts: 517	Re: Defense? illerFFN wrote: Would love to see some hard data/charts of just how many COD players they've actually attracted to this game. B/c everyone I know who plays it came from Unreal or TF2 or Tribes or Mechwarrior or Quake or Heavy Gear or ...etc etc, list goes on. COD players don't have to venture outside of COD b/c a new one comes out every single year. And when that's not enough, they also have BattleField which has free vehicles or some crap. Yea, call of duty kids like "realism" and are busy using aerial death drones to assassinate members of anonymous in Call of Duty 3: Blackops 2. http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/ ... materials/ I come from a quake/team fortress/Counterstrike/tribes/RTCW/RTCW: ET/TF2 background. I've never liked CoD.
Sun May 13, 2012 9:39 pm

Oroibahazopi Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:26 pm Posts: 1139	Re: Defense? Yeah, when I made my post tacs and orbs weren't in my mind as I don't use them often. I really don't think they're necessary to clear a defense at all, there's not really a critical mass of defense that's impenetrable to everything since you can disk snipe it all from across the map anyway. Without tacs and orbs I'd wager that offense and defense are borderline balanced.
Mon May 14, 2012 12:21 am

DibbzTheLoner Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am Posts: 1616 Location: Australia Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz	Re: Defense? Tamburlaine wrote: I just had a f* fantastic time HoFing on Tartarus of all places. Ungodly amounts of offencive pressure. f* mortars and MIRVs everywhere and disk sniping and osniping and raiders going over my head unloading grenade launchers and so many god d* pathfinders crashing my useless f* stand. But our techs and our brutes and our vehicles... so god d* good, those guys were. As soon as a mole popped up, they whacked it down. You ever stick a shovel into a nest of wasps? It's an amazing sight. Jam the blade in to the ground, and for a moment, nothing. Another moment, nothing. You bend over, and then, then you see them. And they rise from that hole in the earth like the blade of your shovel cracked open a passage to hell. Like blood spurting from a wound. Like the return stroke of a bolt of lightning. That's what my defenders were like, and it was f* awesome, and in turn, I was f* awesome. I saw those pathfinders, and I shattered them. If this game had blood, my stand would have pushed it in to an Adults Only rating. If this game had blood, I would have looked like I just stepped out of a Garth Ennis comic. In time I found that the true challenge was not fighting my enemy, it was fighting the urge to wake my roommates with a cry of, "I AM BULLETPROOF!" After some of the bloodiest god d* capture-the-flag I've seen in a long time, it was 4-4. An enemy pathfinder then called in a tac while doing a back-to-front and capped the flag in a matter of seconds. ... ... _________________ This signature is green. I like the colour green. Wait, why are you still reading? It should be obvious that this signature is pointless and just here to be green. Stop reading already! You're procrastinating too much!
Mon May 14, 2012 1:29 am

SFJake Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:11 pm Posts: 381	Re: Defense? You know, even just juggernauts tend to be ridiculously overpowered. Well, not juggernauts only. Take a juggernaut, or a raider, or even a god d* brute. Just slide your way there, shoot whatever does the most spread damage for your class, you don't even have to care, it'll just work. Everything will be cleared, everyone is forced away from the flag stand (or die), especially from a juggernaut, and you're pretty much unstoppable. Even if people start shooting you midfield you can get in and blow up everything. When a jug is on top of a hill in say, Drydock, by the time you get to him he cleared the stand 10 times and is probably out of ammo soon - why bother. Thats not even mentionning strikes, people have done this already. Disc spamming is also ridiculous, completely riskless and blows everything up, even base assets. I hate defense in this game. I have NO idea how it was in the other Tribes but I just find in this one its completely absurd. Where was the skill in all that? Where are the options to defend? What is the point? It does not need a coordinated assault or anything. It just needs one guy sliding anywhere in sight and spamming his s*. I have no idea what is supposed to be entertaining and skill based about this. It would make sense if all this was only possible with the generator down but we all know thats not the case. _________________ http://sfjake.zxq.net
Mon May 14, 2012 2:01 am

illerFFN Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:52 pm Posts: 1174	Re: Defense? lawlertron wrote: http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2012/05/02/why-is-anonymous-in-the-call-of-duty-black-ops-2-materials/ WTH?? ...yeh COD kids probably would be that ignorant
Mon May 14, 2012 2:09 am

Tamburlaine Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:13 am Posts: 1859	Re: Defense? DibbzTheLoner wrote: Tamburlaine wrote: I just had a f* fantastic time HoFing on Tartarus of all places. Ungodly amounts of offencive pressure. f* mortars and MIRVs everywhere and disk sniping and osniping and raiders going over my head unloading grenade launchers and so many god d* pathfinders crashing my useless f* stand. But our techs and our brutes and our vehicles... so god d* good, those guys were. As soon as a mole popped up, they whacked it down. You ever stick a shovel into a nest of wasps? It's an amazing sight. Jam the blade in to the ground, and for a moment, nothing. Another moment, nothing. You bend over, and then, then you see them. And they rise from that hole in the earth like the blade of your shovel cracked open a passage to hell. Like blood spurting from a wound. Like the return stroke of a bolt of lightning. That's what my defenders were like, and it was f* awesome, and in turn, I was f* awesome. I saw those pathfinders, and I shattered them. If this game had blood, my stand would have pushed it in to an Adults Only rating. If this game had blood, I would have looked like I just stepped out of a Garth Ennis comic. In time I found that the true challenge was not fighting my enemy, it was fighting the urge to wake my roommates with a cry of, "I AM BULLETPROOF!" After some of the bloodiest god d* capture-the-flag I've seen in a long time, it was 4-4. An enemy pathfinder then called in a tac while doing a back-to-front and capped the flag in a matter of seconds. ... ... Yeah, pretty much. I am in a very odd position now in that I regret not going the Full IdrA on that pathfinder... _________________ oh god where does this link go how did it get here I am not good with computer
Mon May 14, 2012 10:58 am

ShockWaveEVE Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2011 6:52 pm Posts: 624 Location: Dome City .003 /Medic Sector	Re: Defense? Yea defense is kind of underpowerd due to disk sniping. And maps are geared for easily destroyed defenses near the flagstand.. _________________ ^This is EVE.^ Sending data-complete. ---------------- Name-[+EVE]xshockwavex Kills-26,912 Deaths-8,510 Garbage at dueling great a defending a point(or base) Rank- ---------------- Statistics Probability Complete.
Mon May 14, 2012 11:29 am

Naco2k Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2011 11:13 pm Posts: 84	Re: Defense? shockwavehunter wrote: Yea defense is kind of underpowerd due to disk sniping. And maps are geared for easily destroyed defenses near the flagstand.. Yeah... that why for some maps like drydock, teams have ditched the classic HOF and gone for a foating insta nitron or disc over the stand when the capper goes through.
Mon May 14, 2012 11:40 am

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Defense?

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Tamburlaine

Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:13 am
Posts: 1859

Re: Defense?

Renthrak wrote:

The current game balance allows for good defense. It actually does. The problem is that it doesn't happen, because it's incredibly frustrating and almost completely unrewarding. Half a dozen turrets, a couple force fields, mines scattered everywhere, a decent sniper or two watching the area, a HoF with technicians supporting and maybe a Shrike flying around to chase . . . that's going to require a fair portion of the enemy team to break through, while still leaving half of the friendly team to go for the flag.

And then an orbital reduces that entire defence to a sentinel and a shrike.

_________________
oh god where does this link go how did it get here I am not good with computer

Sun May 13, 2012 4:45 pm

illerFFN

Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:52 pm
Posts: 1174

Re: Defense?

Scratch the Sentinel off too if he was setting up Claymores.

As Sent, ... I probably die to Orbitals 3x more often than I do to INF's and FusionMortars
Trying to get away from that city-block size Conflagration is impossible, I would need the pathfinder's Thrust pack to achieve that kind of escape velocity.

Sun May 13, 2012 4:59 pm

lawlertron

Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2012 8:07 pm
Posts: 517

Re: Defense?

illerFFN wrote:

Would love to see some hard data/charts of just how many COD players they've actually attracted to this game. B/c everyone I know who plays it came from Unreal or TF2 or Tribes or Mechwarrior or Quake or Heavy Gear or ...etc etc, list goes on.

COD players don't have to venture outside of COD b/c a new one comes out every single year.
And when that's not enough, they also have BattleField which has free vehicles or some crap.

Yea, call of duty kids like "realism" and are busy using aerial death drones to assassinate members of anonymous in Call of Duty 3: Blackops 2.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/ ... materials/

I come from a quake/team fortress/Counterstrike/tribes/RTCW/RTCW: ET/TF2 background. I've never liked CoD.

Sun May 13, 2012 9:39 pm

Oroibahazopi

Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:26 pm
Posts: 1139

Re: Defense?

Yeah, when I made my post tacs and orbs weren't in my mind as I don't use them often.

I really don't think they're necessary to clear a defense at all, there's not really a critical mass of defense that's impenetrable to everything since you can disk snipe it all from across the map anyway.

Without tacs and orbs I'd wager that offense and defense are borderline balanced.

Mon May 14, 2012 12:21 am

DibbzTheLoner

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am
Posts: 1616
Location: Australia
Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz

Re: Defense?

Tamburlaine wrote:

I just had a f*** fantastic time HoFing on Tartarus of all places. Ungodly amounts of offencive pressure. f*** mortars and MIRVs everywhere and disk sniping and osniping and raiders going over my head unloading grenade launchers and so many god d*** pathfinders crashing my useless f*** stand. But our techs and our brutes and our vehicles... so god d*** good, those guys were. As soon as a mole popped up, they whacked it down.

You ever stick a shovel into a nest of wasps? It's an amazing sight. Jam the blade in to the ground, and for a moment, nothing. Another moment, nothing. You bend over, and then, then you see them. And they rise from that hole in the earth like the blade of your shovel cracked open a passage to hell. Like blood spurting from a wound. Like the return stroke of a bolt of lightning.

That's what my defenders were like, and it was f*** awesome, and in turn, I was f*** awesome. I saw those pathfinders, and I shattered them. If this game had blood, my stand would have pushed it in to an Adults Only rating. If this game had blood, I would have looked like I just stepped out of a Garth Ennis comic. In time I found that the true challenge was not fighting my enemy, it was fighting the urge to wake my roommates with a cry of, "I AM BULLETPROOF!"

After some of the bloodiest god d*** capture-the-flag I've seen in a long time, it was 4-4. An enemy pathfinder then called in a tac while doing a back-to-front and capped the flag in a matter of seconds.

...

...

_________________
This signature is green. I like the colour green.
Wait, why are you still reading? It should be obvious that this signature is pointless and just here to be green.
Stop reading already! You're procrastinating too much!

Mon May 14, 2012 1:29 am

SFJake

Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:11 pm
Posts: 381

Re: Defense?

You know, even just juggernauts tend to be ridiculously overpowered. Well, not juggernauts only. Take a juggernaut, or a raider, or even a god d*** brute. Just slide your way there, shoot whatever does the most spread damage for your class, you don't even have to care, it'll just work.

Everything will be cleared, everyone is forced away from the flag stand (or die), especially from a juggernaut, and you're pretty much unstoppable. Even if people start shooting you midfield you can get in and blow up everything.

When a jug is on top of a hill in say, Drydock, by the time you get to him he cleared the stand 10 times and is probably out of ammo soon - why bother.

Thats not even mentionning strikes, people have done this already. Disc spamming is also ridiculous, completely riskless and blows everything up, even base assets.

I hate defense in this game. I have NO idea how it was in the other Tribes but I just find in this one its completely absurd. Where was the skill in all that? Where are the options to defend? What is the point? It does not need a coordinated assault or anything. It just needs one guy sliding anywhere in sight and spamming his s***.

I have no idea what is supposed to be entertaining and skill based about this. It would make sense if all this was only possible with the generator down but we all know thats not the case.

_________________
http://sfjake.zxq.net

Mon May 14, 2012 2:01 am

illerFFN

Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:52 pm
Posts: 1174

Re: Defense?

lawlertron wrote:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2012/05/02/why-is-anonymous-in-the-call-of-duty-black-ops-2-materials/

WTH??

...yeh COD kids probably would be that ignorant

Mon May 14, 2012 2:09 am

Tamburlaine

Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:13 am
Posts: 1859

Re: Defense?

DibbzTheLoner wrote:

Tamburlaine wrote:

...

...

Yeah, pretty much.

I am in a very odd position now in that I regret not going the Full IdrA on that pathfinder...

_________________
oh god where does this link go how did it get here I am not good with computer

Mon May 14, 2012 10:58 am

ShockWaveEVE

Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2011 6:52 pm
Posts: 624
Location: Dome City .003 /Medic Sector

Re: Defense?

Yea defense is kind of underpowerd due to disk sniping.
And maps are geared for easily destroyed defenses near the flagstand..

_________________

^This is EVE.^
Sending data-complete.
----------------
Name-[+EVE]xshockwavex
Kills-26,912
Deaths-8,510
Garbage at dueling great a defending a point(or base)
Rank-

----------------
Statistics Probability Complete.

Mon May 14, 2012 11:29 am

Naco2k

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2011 11:13 pm
Posts: 84

Re: Defense?

shockwavehunter wrote:

Yea defense is kind of underpowerd due to disk sniping.
And maps are geared for easily destroyed defenses near the flagstand..

Yeah... that why for some maps like drydock, teams have ditched the classic HOF and gone for a foating insta nitron or disc over the stand when the capper goes through.

Mon May 14, 2012 11:40 am

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Defense?