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[POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?
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GenericKen Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:59 am Posts: 63	[POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers? I think it's safe to say that everyone would love to see more than 9 CTF maps. But where would Hi-Rez put them? Custom servers are great, but pubs are going to be where the majority of players hang out. Hi-Rez can't just put 12 or 15 maps on a server's rotation - for a new map to go in, an old map usually has to go out. Hi-Rez has been trying to add more maps by adding game-modes, but unfortunately, this segments the player base. It's hard to have level 6-12 servers if you're already splitting your population 4 ways within each region. I think Hi-Rez needs to introduce map-seasons. Every 2 weeks, change the set of maps on the pubs. Publish a schedule of what goes up - people can vote for popular maps, they can look forward to old favorites coming back, and they can get excited when new maps premiere on the rotation. If players really want to play a map off-season, they can rent a custom server. It's a monetization vector not unlike LoL's free-tier characters, and unlike selling overpowered guns, it doesn't risk unbalancing the game and killing the goose that lays the golden egg. Off-topic, I also think that 4 different player queues for 4 game modes is too many. I don't know if anyone would agree with me here, but I'm thinking that TDM and Arena should share a queue, as should C&H and CTF. If the population for any one of those game modes becomes too small, Hi-Rez just has to kill it off, like they had to kill non-team Rabbit. Bottom line, 3 questions for the poll: 1) Should Hi-Rez introduce map rotations to pubs? If not, how should they introduce new maps to the pubs? 2) What's the ideal number of maps in a pub map rotation? 3) Should Hi-Rez consolidate the game queues for different game modes? What's the maximum number of sustainable pub queues (plus custom servers)? What's the average number of different game mode pub queues you join per gaming-session?
Mon May 07, 2012 2:57 am

AwwThatsTooBad Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2012 3:43 pm Posts: 712	Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers? why can't they run every map? add votemap in, simple. valve runs like 25 on their 13134134141241 official tf2 servers, just they let players skip them _________________ I am looking to learn top secret flag punting skills since I can't cap. I am looking to learn top secret ninja hold-down-fire-button auto spamming skill tactics so I can play in the 35-50 kiddie pool. I am higher rank than all of you, therefore, I am obviously better than all of you.
Mon May 07, 2012 6:56 am

Diknak Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 1:28 pm Posts: 553	Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers? why would you need to take one out when putting one in? That doesn't make sense at all. It adds more variety and will keep people around longer. OP makes no sense. I would love 500 CTF maps and always feel like I am playing something new. _________________ do \|\| !do; try; #Error: Command try not found.
Mon May 07, 2012 8:26 am

TheEschaton Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:53 pm Posts: 2941 Steam Gamer Name: LeadProphet	Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers? Public servers need lots of maps, but esports don't. For CTF, I'd like to see around 15-20 maps in rotation, eventually. That's a really big number - big enough that in a few hours of play you don't go through all maps. That's good for a variety of reasons: 1. Encourages people to play longer so they can see a favorite map come up, keeping servers populated. 2. Slows down the ability of people to learn how to farm a given map because they don't get to play it over and over. 3. A variety of maps encourages people to learn a variety of playstyles, so that individual class nerfs/buffs will have less of an impact on player retention counts (people will just switch to playing another way that isn't as affected by the buffs/nerfs in question). Downsides might include player frustration at a higher learning curve, and generally less-coordinated pub play (people aren't as sure about what to do on a map they don't know very well), but if the maps are all introduced in packs of 3 or so every couple months, those problems should be mitigated. _________________ Carrion (in-game name)
Mon May 07, 2012 9:34 am

DemoEvolved Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 10:28 am Posts: 2031	Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers? GenericKen wrote: Bottom line, 3 questions for the poll: 1) Should Hi-Rez introduce map rotations to pubs? If not, how should they introduce new maps to the pubs? 2) What's the ideal number of maps in a pub map rotation? 3) Should Hi-Rez consolidate the game queues for different game modes? What's the maximum number of sustainable pub queues (plus custom servers)? What's the average number of different game mode pub queues you join per gaming-session? 1) Yes. 2) Varies by rotation period. If it is 1 month, then 10 maps for starters. 3) If I queue for CTF, no way in heck do I want to wind up in C&H. If I queue for C&H, I want C&H. etc... So what is this question really about? Per session I join about 1.2 different game mode queues. eg. usually just ctf, but once every 15 nights or so, I will do 1 queue of each gametype.
Mon May 07, 2012 10:42 am

Yetskii Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 7:34 am Posts: 754	Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers? 42, of course
Mon May 07, 2012 10:44 am

Pingles Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:28 pm Posts: 1733	Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers? ALL THE MAPS _________________
Mon May 07, 2012 12:31 pm

OuchMyBoobies Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:32 pm Posts: 992 Location: Eastern US	Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers? GenericKen wrote: Hi-Rez can't just put 12 or 15 maps on a server's rotation of course they can. it was pretty typical in my quake 3 days for servers to have well over a dozen maps (usually twice that) in rotation. in especially large rotations, you could add the more popular maps more than once as well, so you didn't have to wait as long. the rotation method you describe (seasonal) is more or less how blizzard handles their ladder map pool for starcraft 2. it's fine for them, but for a fps there really is no downside to having a large map pool, besides having to wait longer for your favorite map to come up. i'm all for removing maps in favor of better maps, but at this point i think we just need to get to a solid number first (i'd say 12 minimum). GenericKen wrote: Off-topic, I also think that 4 different player queues for 4 game modes is too many. I don't know if anyone would agree with me here, but I'm thinking that TDM and Arena should share a queue, as should C&H and CTF. nope. if i want to play a certain mode, i do not want to be queued up for some other mode. it's fine as it is.
Mon May 07, 2012 12:42 pm

GenericKen Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:59 am Posts: 63	Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers? I hate waitin for my favorite maps to come up. 10-15 might be fine for the rest of you, but I can rarely spare more than 1 or 2 consecutive hours for play. He tribes community is aging - i suspect that most of us have jobs and families now. What's the avg length of your play sessions?
Wed May 09, 2012 6:46 pm

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[POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

Author

Message

GenericKen

Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:59 am
Posts: 63

[POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

I think it's safe to say that everyone would love to see more than 9 CTF maps. But where would Hi-Rez put them?

Custom servers are great, but pubs are going to be where the majority of players hang out. Hi-Rez can't just put 12 or 15 maps on a server's rotation - for a new map to go in, an old map usually has to go out.

Hi-Rez has been trying to add more maps by adding game-modes, but unfortunately, this segments the player base. It's hard to have level 6-12 servers if you're already splitting your population 4 ways within each region.

I think Hi-Rez needs to introduce map-seasons. Every 2 weeks, change the set of maps on the pubs. Publish a schedule of what goes up - people can vote for popular maps, they can look forward to old favorites coming back, and they can get excited when new maps premiere on the rotation. If players really want to play a map off-season, they can rent a custom server. It's a monetization vector not unlike LoL's free-tier characters, and unlike selling overpowered guns, it doesn't risk unbalancing the game and killing the goose that lays the golden egg.

Off-topic, I also think that 4 different player queues for 4 game modes is too many. I don't know if anyone would agree with me here, but I'm thinking that TDM and Arena should share a queue, as should C&H and CTF. If the population for any one of those game modes becomes too small, Hi-Rez just has to kill it off, like they had to kill non-team Rabbit.

Bottom line, 3 questions for the poll:
1) Should Hi-Rez introduce map rotations to pubs? If not, how should they introduce new maps to the pubs?

2) What's the ideal number of maps in a pub map rotation?

3) Should Hi-Rez consolidate the game queues for different game modes? What's the maximum number of sustainable pub queues (plus custom servers)? What's the average number of different game mode pub queues you join per gaming-session?

Mon May 07, 2012 2:57 am

AwwThatsTooBad

Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2012 3:43 pm
Posts: 712

Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

why can't they run every map? add votemap in, simple.

valve runs like 25 on their 13134134141241 official tf2 servers, just they let players skip them

_________________
I am looking to learn top secret flag punting skills since I can't cap.
I am looking to learn top secret ninja hold-down-fire-button auto spamming skill tactics so I can play in the 35-50 kiddie pool.

I am higher rank than all of you, therefore, I am obviously better than all of you.

Mon May 07, 2012 6:56 am

Diknak

Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 1:28 pm
Posts: 553

Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

why would you need to take one out when putting one in? That doesn't make sense at all. It adds more variety and will keep people around longer. OP makes no sense.

I would love 500 CTF maps and always feel like I am playing something new.

_________________
do || !do;
try;
#Error: Command try not found.

Mon May 07, 2012 8:26 am

TheEschaton

Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:53 pm
Posts: 2941
Steam Gamer Name: LeadProphet

Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

Public servers need lots of maps, but esports don't.

For CTF, I'd like to see around 15-20 maps in rotation, eventually. That's a really big number - big enough that in a few hours of play you don't go through all maps. That's good for a variety of reasons:

1. Encourages people to play longer so they can see a favorite map come up, keeping servers populated.

2. Slows down the ability of people to learn how to farm a given map because they don't get to play it over and over.

3. A variety of maps encourages people to learn a variety of playstyles, so that individual class nerfs/buffs will have less of an impact on player retention counts (people will just switch to playing another way that isn't as affected by the buffs/nerfs in question).

Downsides might include player frustration at a higher learning curve, and generally less-coordinated pub play (people aren't as sure about what to do on a map they don't know very well), but if the maps are all introduced in packs of 3 or so every couple months, those problems should be mitigated.

_________________
Carrion (in-game name)

Mon May 07, 2012 9:34 am

DemoEvolved

Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 10:28 am
Posts: 2031

Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

GenericKen wrote:

Bottom line, 3 questions for the poll:
1) Should Hi-Rez introduce map rotations to pubs? If not, how should they introduce new maps to the pubs?

2) What's the ideal number of maps in a pub map rotation?

3) Should Hi-Rez consolidate the game queues for different game modes? What's the maximum number of sustainable pub queues (plus custom servers)? What's the average number of different game mode pub queues you join per gaming-session?

1) Yes.

2) Varies by rotation period. If it is 1 month, then 10 maps for starters.

3) If I queue for CTF, no way in heck do I want to wind up in C&H. If I queue for C&H, I want C&H. etc... So what is this question really about? Per session I join about 1.2 different game mode queues. eg. usually just ctf, but once every 15 nights or so, I will do 1 queue of each gametype.

Mon May 07, 2012 10:42 am

Yetskii

Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 7:34 am
Posts: 754

Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

42, of course

Mon May 07, 2012 10:44 am

Pingles

Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:28 pm
Posts: 1733

Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

ALL THE MAPS

_________________

Mon May 07, 2012 12:31 pm

OuchMyBoobies

Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:32 pm
Posts: 992
Location: Eastern US

Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

GenericKen wrote:

Hi-Rez can't just put 12 or 15 maps on a server's rotation

of course they can. it was pretty typical in my quake 3 days for servers to have well over a dozen maps (usually twice that) in rotation. in especially large rotations, you could add the more popular maps more than once as well, so you didn't have to wait as long.

the rotation method you describe (seasonal) is more or less how blizzard handles their ladder map pool for starcraft 2. it's fine for them, but for a fps there really is no downside to having a large map pool, besides having to wait longer for your favorite map to come up. i'm all for removing maps in favor of better maps, but at this point i think we just need to get to a solid number first (i'd say 12 minimum).

GenericKen wrote:

Off-topic, I also think that 4 different player queues for 4 game modes is too many. I don't know if anyone would agree with me here, but I'm thinking that TDM and Arena should share a queue, as should C&H and CTF.

nope. if i want to play a certain mode, i do not want to be queued up for some other mode. it's fine as it is.

Mon May 07, 2012 12:42 pm

GenericKen

Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:59 am
Posts: 63

Re: [POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?

I hate waitin for my favorite maps to come up.

10-15 might be fine for the rest of you, but I can rarely spare more than 1 or 2 consecutive hours for play. He tribes community is aging - i suspect that most of us have jobs and families now.

What's the avg length of your play sessions?

Wed May 09, 2012 6:46 pm

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[POLL] What's the right number of maps for public servers?