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Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.
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AnnexDNB Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2011 6:34 pm Posts: 145	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. really, it shouldnt take the amount of time it does to lock onto somebody... seriously the amount of time to lock on, the person is on the ground again anyways.. _________________ played t1 and t2, burned vengeance Love to cap, chase and play D i7 2600k@4.8ghz GSkill Ripjawz X 16gb ddr3 1600mhz ATI 6970 i want custom loadouts and good disc jumping http://www.youtube.com/user/DNBAnnex?feature=mhee TA vids inside!
Sat May 05, 2012 1:01 pm

demontrace Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:48 am Posts: 37	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. hvcterr wrote: In other words, you want interruptions to "slowly rewind" the locking-progress, rather than instantly resetting it to zero? That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another. Actually, I'd like to suggest merging it with this control-scheme change: hvcterr wrote: The Saber should only begin locking when you are holding the mouse button. Once this starts, it should ignore all different enemies until you release the button. Even if your original target goes behind an obstacle at the same moment another enemy moves across your screen. As soon as the lock is done, it should auto-fire the rocket immediately. You must remember to release the button at this point. This solves the "I just want to see targets, I don't want to let them know I'm around yet" problem and the "d*** stop flipping changing the target" problem and the "clickclickclickclick" problem all at once, significantly reducing frustration without (yet) introducing any balance alterations. This way there's no exploiting a "progress transfer" bug, and other enemies flying around won't "reset" your progress as it flips between targets, and the game doesn't need to keep an independent progress-counter for every single Doombrings/Enemy combination. Agree completely!
Sat May 05, 2012 4:25 pm

mystrdat Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:42 pm Posts: 100 Location: Prague, CZ	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. No way, you'd be able to resume lock on someone that has previously touched ground to evade your lock and the game would pretty much turn to a guided missile spam - every single attacker would have at least 6 missiles chasing him at all times and the Doombringer would lose it's purpose. Thumbs down. _________________ I Blue Plate people in the air sometimes Sayin' ay-oh, gotta let go. stream: http://twitch.tv/mystrdat
Sun May 06, 2012 9:41 am

xSNAKEx Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:43 am Posts: 33	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. mystrdat wrote: No way, you'd be able to resume lock on someone that has previously touched ground to evade your lock and the game would pretty much turn to a guided missile spam - every single attacker would have at least 6 missiles chasing him at all times and the Doombringer would lose it's purpose. Thumbs down. Alright, first of all, if somebody touches down after being close to locked onto by a sabre, they will likely have spent a fair amount of time in the air already and be low on energy which means it would be a good idea for them to ski for a while before they boost again. This would almost rewind the clock back to zero. Even pro skiers use the ground for as long as they can to recharge energy. That said, I see your point, and I never wanted the 2 way timer to be implemented in this way. I am ok if touching the ground means the timer counter goes terminal and resets. What I think needs rectifying is while the target is in the air, when the timer resets due to to a shrub, tree, pole etc in your sight, or if you make a mistake and move your cursor of them for a split milisecond.
Sun May 06, 2012 10:16 am

starlinvf Beta Tester Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:31 am Posts: 1478	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. mystrdat wrote: No way, you'd be able to resume lock on someone that has previously touched ground to evade your lock and the game would pretty much turn to a guided missile spam - every single attacker would have at least 6 missiles chasing him at all times and the Doombringer would lose it's purpose. Thumbs down. I don't think you understand the concept of a wind-down timer. A target would need to stick to the ground in order to make the timer to decay, which lets them intentionally extend the lock squance with every touch of the ground, or ski for a couple seconds to utterly terminate it. It also opens up a few more balancing channels since you can set the timer to decay faster then it builds up. With this approach, anyone hugging the ground can avoid a lock, but high fliers that simply scrape the hill tops, or are obstructed by random objects don't get away scot-free. With that change in reliability, other aspects of the weapon can now be tweaked around it. Now the Saber doesn't have to be a complete waste, and a free firing alternative has less roles it needs to fill. _________________ "Even if it is just a gimmick, you can bet it'll be a crowd pleaser to see a player's feet kick up in the air and initiate a top down attack."
Sun May 06, 2012 10:21 am

Pingles Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:28 pm Posts: 1733	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. I try to "skip" if I have flag and hear lock attempts. Just a quick tap on the ground. It's a big drop in my skiing, escape speed and I think an appropriate risk/reward thing. This new setup would remove that. _________________
Sun May 06, 2012 11:07 am

starlinvf Beta Tester Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:31 am Posts: 1478	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. Pingles wrote: I try to "skip" if I have flag and hear lock attempts. Just a quick tap on the ground. It's a big drop in my skiing, escape speed and I think an appropriate risk/reward thing. This new setup would remove that. It doesn't really change anything. You still spend a significant amount of time on the ground, and terrain will still interfere with the lock. _________________ "Even if it is just a gimmick, you can bet it'll be a crowd pleaser to see a player's feet kick up in the air and initiate a top down attack."
Sun May 06, 2012 1:57 pm

phosphor112 Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:04 pm Posts: 262	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. BUT SABER LAUNCHERS ARE SO ANNOYING AND POWERFUL AND... Yeah... yeah they are really bad. They can hardly keep up with a shrike... trying to shoot down a pathfinder is even harder. I shot off over 5 missiles on crossfire at a PTH with my flag. All 5 blew up... zero hit him, zero hit the terrain, they all blew up in the middle of the air because it couldn't keep up. Mind you, I was chasing him a the same time, so it's not like I was just shooting at him from my base. _________________ Fix skiing deadstops.
Mon May 07, 2012 1:20 am

HVFlateric Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:36 am Posts: 734	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. Unfortunately if history is any lesson to us here, HR doesn't care nor wish to bother fixing weapons that are underpower or in a poor state. It seems they only adjust massively OP weapons with any kind of reasonably quick actions. The Sabre has been waiting for a fix since the begining of closed beta, the Mortar and Merv as well. At this point seriously HiRez, what is it going to take to get these things looked at? Hunders and hundreds of posts about the issue stretching since nearly the begining of TA time? Check we got that. Heavies get very little attention and even less correction than the other classes. Unfortunately we also make the largest target that moves the slowest and has the least energy. Please, atleast TRY adjusting some of these things guys, you do it with other classes and weapons. It's seriously LONG overdue for balancing these issues. Atleast if you must do some minor tweaks each patch till these things get dialed in. You recently posted that you move fast and make changes and sometimes this causes problems. Not asking for this, just how about a little progress and lets start moving towards correcting things. PLEASE! _________________ (Former Admin on Houston Vehicles & Miami Vehicles)
Mon May 07, 2012 2:40 am

HVFlateric Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:36 am Posts: 734	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. As far as lock goes they should implement a heat based lock such as T2 which worked well and did not annoy everyone so much, flare nades should be a option as well for evading. _________________ (Former Admin on Houston Vehicles & Miami Vehicles)
Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 am

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Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

Author

Message

AnnexDNB

Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2011 6:34 pm
Posts: 145

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

really, it shouldnt take the amount of time it does to lock onto somebody... seriously the amount of time to lock on, the person is on the ground again anyways..

_________________
played t1 and t2, burned vengeance
Love to cap, chase and play D
i7 2600k@4.8ghz GSkill Ripjawz X 16gb ddr3 1600mhz ATI 6970 i want custom loadouts and good disc jumping

http://www.youtube.com/user/DNBAnnex?feature=mhee TA vids inside!

Sat May 05, 2012 1:01 pm

demontrace

Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:48 am
Posts: 37

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

hvcterr wrote:

In other words, you want interruptions to "slowly rewind" the locking-progress, rather than instantly resetting it to zero?

That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another. Actually, I'd like to suggest merging it with this control-scheme change:

hvcterr wrote:

The Saber should only begin locking when you are holding the mouse button.
Once this starts, it should ignore all different enemies until you release the button. Even if your original target goes behind an obstacle at the same moment another enemy moves across your screen.
As soon as the lock is done, it should auto-fire the rocket immediately. You must remember to release the button at this point.

This solves the "I just want to see targets, I don't want to let them know I'm around yet" problem and the "d*** stop flipping changing the target" problem and the "clickclickclickclick" problem all at once, significantly reducing frustration without (yet) introducing any balance alterations.

This way there's no exploiting a "progress transfer" bug, and other enemies flying around won't "reset" your progress as it flips between targets, and the game doesn't need to keep an independent progress-counter for every single Doombrings/Enemy combination.

Agree completely!

Sat May 05, 2012 4:25 pm

mystrdat

Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 6:42 pm
Posts: 100
Location: Prague, CZ

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

No way, you'd be able to resume lock on someone that has previously touched ground to evade your lock and the game would pretty much turn to a guided missile spam - every single attacker would have at least 6 missiles chasing him at all times and the Doombringer would lose it's purpose. Thumbs down.

_________________
I Blue Plate people in the air sometimes
Sayin' ay-oh, gotta let go.

stream: http://twitch.tv/mystrdat

Sun May 06, 2012 9:41 am

xSNAKEx

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:43 am
Posts: 33

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

mystrdat wrote:

Alright, first of all, if somebody touches down after being close to locked onto by a sabre, they will likely have spent a fair amount of time in the air already and be low on energy which means it would be a good idea for them to ski for a while before they boost again. This would almost rewind the clock back to zero. Even pro skiers use the ground for as long as they can to recharge energy.

That said, I see your point, and I never wanted the 2 way timer to be implemented in this way.

I am ok if touching the ground means the timer counter goes terminal and resets.
What I think needs rectifying is while the target is in the air, when the timer resets due to to a shrub, tree, pole etc in your sight, or if you make a mistake and move your cursor of them for a split milisecond.

Sun May 06, 2012 10:16 am

starlinvf

Beta Tester

Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:31 am
Posts: 1478

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

mystrdat wrote:

I don't think you understand the concept of a wind-down timer. A target would need to stick to the ground in order to make the timer to decay, which lets them intentionally extend the lock squance with every touch of the ground, or ski for a couple seconds to utterly terminate it.

It also opens up a few more balancing channels since you can set the timer to decay faster then it builds up. With this approach, anyone hugging the ground can avoid a lock, but high fliers that simply scrape the hill tops, or are obstructed by random objects don't get away scot-free.

With that change in reliability, other aspects of the weapon can now be tweaked around it. Now the Saber doesn't have to be a complete waste, and a free firing alternative has less roles it needs to fill.

_________________
"Even if it is just a gimmick, you can bet it'll be a crowd pleaser to see a player's feet kick up in the air and initiate a top down attack."

Sun May 06, 2012 10:21 am

Pingles

Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:28 pm
Posts: 1733

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

I try to "skip" if I have flag and hear lock attempts. Just a quick tap on the ground.

It's a big drop in my skiing, escape speed and I think an appropriate risk/reward thing.

This new setup would remove that.

_________________

Sun May 06, 2012 11:07 am

starlinvf

Beta Tester

Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:31 am
Posts: 1478

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

Pingles wrote:

It doesn't really change anything. You still spend a significant amount of time on the ground, and terrain will still interfere with the lock.

_________________
"Even if it is just a gimmick, you can bet it'll be a crowd pleaser to see a player's feet kick up in the air and initiate a top down attack."

Sun May 06, 2012 1:57 pm

phosphor112

Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:04 pm
Posts: 262

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

BUT SABER LAUNCHERS ARE SO ANNOYING AND POWERFUL AND...

Yeah... yeah they are really bad.

They can hardly keep up with a shrike... trying to shoot down a pathfinder is even harder.

I shot off over 5 missiles on crossfire at a PTH with my flag. All 5 blew up... zero hit him, zero hit the terrain, they all blew up in the middle of the air because it couldn't keep up. Mind you, I was chasing him a the same time, so it's not like I was just shooting at him from my base.

_________________

Fix skiing deadstops.

Mon May 07, 2012 1:20 am

HVFlateric

Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:36 am
Posts: 734

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

Unfortunately if history is any lesson to us here, HR doesn't care nor wish to bother fixing weapons that are underpower or in a poor state.

It seems they only adjust massively OP weapons with any kind of reasonably quick actions.

The Sabre has been waiting for a fix since the begining of closed beta, the Mortar and Merv as well.

At this point seriously HiRez, what is it going to take to get these things looked at? Hunders and hundreds of posts about the issue stretching since nearly the begining of TA time? Check we got that.

Heavies get very little attention and even less correction than the other classes. Unfortunately we also make the largest target that moves the slowest and has the least energy.

Please, atleast TRY adjusting some of these things guys, you do it with other classes and weapons.

It's seriously LONG overdue for balancing these issues.

Atleast if you must do some minor tweaks each patch till these things get dialed in.

You recently posted that you move fast and make changes and sometimes this causes problems. Not asking for this, just how about a little progress and lets start moving towards correcting things.

PLEASE!

_________________
(Former Admin on Houston Vehicles & Miami Vehicles)

Mon May 07, 2012 2:40 am

HVFlateric

Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:36 am
Posts: 734

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

As far as lock goes they should implement a heat based lock such as T2 which worked well and did not annoy everyone so much, flare nades should be a option as well for evading.

_________________
(Former Admin on Houston Vehicles & Miami Vehicles)

Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 am

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Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.