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Automatic weapon balance?
Author	Message
Arrob Joined: Sun Apr 01, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 128	Re: Automatic weapon balance? D Remove them. Only Spinfusor Duels are true Skill, because you have the possibility to evade. Its not only dependant on 1 Player like automatics and saber launcher. Skiing, Jumping, Energie, Tactics, everything becomes irrelevant in a Duel if it with automatics. So automatics are only there for tipical shooter players to come to tribes and get frags, eventhough theyre to bad for the core of the game.
Sun May 06, 2012 9:03 am

miqueloz Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 7:55 pm Posts: 267	Re: Automatic weapon balance? shazbeta wrote: This is true. Anyone using a projectile weapon more than ~20% of the time, is essentially choosing fun, challenge and/or respect over victory. Self-handicapping is when people who have been made aware of their own incompetence or probable future failure, deliberately impose handicaps on themselves—on the standard model, in order to give themselves an excuse for failure. To make sure they had an excuse, subjects reduced preparation times for athletic events, studied less, exerted less effort, gave opponents an advantage, lowered their own expectations, even took a drug they had been told was performance-inhibiting...
Sun May 06, 2012 10:37 am

Tarqon Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2010 5:20 pm Posts: 144	Re: Automatic weapon balance? miqueloz wrote: shazbeta wrote: This is true. Anyone using a projectile weapon more than ~20% of the time, is essentially choosing fun, challenge and/or respect over victory. Self-handicapping is when people who have been made aware of their own incompetence or probable future failure, deliberately impose handicaps on themselves—on the standard model, in order to give themselves an excuse for failure. To make sure they had an excuse, subjects reduced preparation times for athletic events, studied less, exerted less effort, gave opponents an advantage, lowered their own expectations, even took a drug they had been told was performance-inhibiting... Play to win, nice. --- Again, everyone who contrasts autos with projectile weapons is an absolute moron. This is tribes, they're supposed to be complementary. That's why weapon swap times need to be brought down.
Sun May 06, 2012 2:04 pm

Arrob Joined: Sun Apr 01, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 128	Re: Automatic weapon balance? miqueloz wrote: shazbeta wrote: This is true. Anyone using a projectile weapon more than ~20% of the time, is essentially choosing fun, challenge and/or respect over victory. Self-handicapping is when people who have been made aware of their own incompetence or probable future failure, deliberately impose handicaps on themselves—on the standard model, in order to give themselves an excuse for failure. To make sure they had an excuse, subjects reduced preparation times for athletic events, studied less, exerted less effort, gave opponents an advantage, lowered their own expectations, even took a drug they had been told was performance-inhibiting... Thats a good explanation of self-handicapping. I am a big opponent of automatics to and nearly dont use it. But is this self handicapping? The only thing i want is a good spinfusor/explosive duell, if i want to duel and not to cap for example. I want both to be exactly the same, same weapons, upgrades, etc and then to have a fair fight. i dont want any handicap, and i think he dont want it too. its only that were against automatics, because it destroys the awesomeness of tribes duel.
Sun May 06, 2012 2:14 pm

DeadCellSpawn Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 12:12 am Posts: 407	Re: Automatic weapon balance? honestly what makes shooting peoples feet where they land with a spinfusor fun? those duels are so boring whoever has the most jetpack always wins. they always last too long and someone else will come and interfere making it a 2 on 1 duel. honestly i have way more fun trying to lead and track with the automatics and then shooting the ground with AOE when they land. to me flying around over peoples heads with only an AOE weapon is boring and dull. but hey if you guys want to play like that good for you. i will continue using my entire loadout to keep a constant output of damage on you while you try to fly around me like a derp.
Sun May 06, 2012 3:22 pm

DibbzTheLoner Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am Posts: 1616 Location: Australia Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz	Re: Automatic weapon balance? DeadCellSpawn wrote: honestly what makes shooting peoples feet where they land with a spinfusor fun? Generalising all explosive combat as shooting peoples feet That's just as wrong as if I were to generalise all bullet combat as holding down fire and wiggling the mouse back and forth until the enemy dies. The fun and skillful part is going for midairs. If you get into a duel and suddenly realise "oh crap he has a lot more jetpack fuel than me" then risking a midair can potentially turn the tables, especially if you force the enemy downwards by shooting them in the head. _________________ This signature is green. I like the colour green. Wait, why are you still reading? It should be obvious that this signature is pointless and just here to be green. Stop reading already! You're procrastinating too much! Last edited by DibbzTheLoner on Sun May 06, 2012 3:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Sun May 06, 2012 3:36 pm

ArchangelXv1 Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:05 pm Posts: 1600 Location: Oahu,Hawaii	Re: Automatic weapon balance? ...I think you're missing the point. The fact that you said "continue to fly around me" kinda proves it. It's unfortunate, but to survive in this game against autos (barely) you have to be on the ground. The Auto has no weaknesses in comparison to the explosive weapons. _________________ Communication is a very worthy thing. Fool's Epic T1 Movie
Sun May 06, 2012 3:37 pm

-AEnubis- Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:40 am Posts: 4870 Location: NA East	Re: Automatic weapon balance? DeadCellSpawn wrote: honestly what makes shooting peoples feet where they land with a spinfusor fun? All the more reason you're biased, and have no place giving this discussion input. -AEnubis- wrote: Some people have enough talent that they actually can afford to be picky about how they want to frag. Oh yeah! The OTHER reason people self impose handicaps. Speaking in absolutes is exaggeration to attempt to compensate for lack of logic, exemplary of the fact that "You don't know what you're talking about." _________________ Physics \| CTF Scoring \| Team Selection
Sun May 06, 2012 3:38 pm

cameirus Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 10:32 am Posts: 99	Re: Automatic weapon balance? DeadCellSpawn wrote: honestly what makes shooting peoples feet where they land with a spinfusor fun? those duels are so boring whoever has the most jetpack always wins. they always last too long and someone else will come and interfere making it a 2 on 1 duel. . Timing energy management Motion prediction Inheritance And the epicness of a blue plate special or air mail... Autos encourage static play, spin fusors and explosives encourage speed as they make you much more likely to survive. With autos, speed is irrelevant to a large degree. explosive duels feel tense and on teh knife edge, Autos are just point and click snoozefests I can get in any other FPS.
Sun May 06, 2012 5:02 pm

Varonth Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:14 pm Posts: 111	Re: Automatic weapon balance? My idea to balance autos: Reduce damage by 20% across the board. Give medium armored classes another 20~30% damage reduction against projectile weapons. Let the raiders shield pack take the current amount of damage. Give heavy armored classes another 60~80% damage reduction against projectile weapons, making them basically near useless, to compensate how easy it is to hit said heavies with these weapons.
Sun May 06, 2012 6:41 pm

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Automatic weapon balance?

Author

Message

Arrob

Joined: Sun Apr 01, 2012 5:09 am
Posts: 128

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

D
Remove them.
Only Spinfusor Duels are true Skill, because you have the possibility to evade. Its not only dependant on 1 Player like automatics and saber launcher. Skiing, Jumping, Energie, Tactics, everything becomes irrelevant in a Duel if it with automatics. So automatics are only there for tipical shooter players to come to tribes and get frags, eventhough theyre to bad for the core of the game.

Sun May 06, 2012 9:03 am

miqueloz

Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 7:55 pm
Posts: 267

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

shazbeta wrote:

This is true. Anyone using a projectile weapon more than ~20% of the time, is essentially choosing fun, challenge and/or respect over victory.

Self-handicapping is when people who have been made aware of their own incompetence or probable future failure, deliberately impose handicaps on themselves—on the standard model, in order to give themselves an excuse for failure. To make sure they had an excuse, subjects reduced preparation times for athletic events, studied less, exerted less effort, gave opponents an advantage, lowered their own expectations, even took a drug they had been told was performance-inhibiting...

Sun May 06, 2012 10:37 am

Tarqon

Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2010 5:20 pm
Posts: 144

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

miqueloz wrote:

shazbeta wrote:

This is true. Anyone using a projectile weapon more than ~20% of the time, is essentially choosing fun, challenge and/or respect over victory.

Play to win, nice.

---

Again, everyone who contrasts autos with projectile weapons is an absolute moron. This is tribes, they're supposed to be complementary. That's why weapon swap times need to be brought down.

Sun May 06, 2012 2:04 pm

Arrob

Joined: Sun Apr 01, 2012 5:09 am
Posts: 128

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

miqueloz wrote:

shazbeta wrote:

This is true. Anyone using a projectile weapon more than ~20% of the time, is essentially choosing fun, challenge and/or respect over victory.

Thats a good explanation of self-handicapping. I am a big opponent of automatics to and nearly dont use it. But is this self handicapping? The only thing i want is a good spinfusor/explosive duell, if i want to duel and not to cap for example. I want both to be exactly the same, same weapons, upgrades, etc and then to have a fair fight. i dont want any handicap, and i think he dont want it too. its only that were against automatics, because it destroys the awesomeness of tribes duel.

Sun May 06, 2012 2:14 pm

DeadCellSpawn

Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 12:12 am
Posts: 407

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

honestly what makes shooting peoples feet where they land with a spinfusor fun? those duels are so boring whoever has the most jetpack always wins. they always last too long and someone else will come and interfere making it a 2 on 1 duel.

honestly i have way more fun trying to lead and track with the automatics and then shooting the ground with AOE when they land. to me flying around over peoples heads with only an AOE weapon is boring and dull. but hey if you guys want to play like that good for you. i will continue using my entire loadout to keep a constant output of damage on you while you try to fly around me like a derp.

Sun May 06, 2012 3:22 pm

DibbzTheLoner

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am
Posts: 1616
Location: Australia
Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

DeadCellSpawn wrote:

honestly what makes shooting peoples feet where they land with a spinfusor fun?

Generalising all explosive combat as shooting peoples feet :roll:

That's just as wrong as if I were to generalise all bullet combat as holding down fire and wiggling the mouse back and forth until the enemy dies.

The fun and skillful part is going for midairs. If you get into a duel and suddenly realise "oh crap he has a lot more jetpack fuel than me" then risking a midair can potentially turn the tables, especially if you force the enemy downwards by shooting them in the head.

_________________
This signature is green. I like the colour green.
Wait, why are you still reading? It should be obvious that this signature is pointless and just here to be green.
Stop reading already! You're procrastinating too much!

Last edited by DibbzTheLoner on Sun May 06, 2012 3:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sun May 06, 2012 3:36 pm

ArchangelXv1

Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:05 pm
Posts: 1600
Location: Oahu,Hawaii

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

...I think you're missing the point. The fact that you said "continue to fly around me" kinda proves it. It's unfortunate, but to survive in this game against autos (barely) you have to be on the ground.

The Auto has no weaknesses in comparison to the explosive weapons.

_________________
Communication is a very worthy thing.

Fool's Epic T1 Movie

Sun May 06, 2012 3:37 pm

-AEnubis-

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:40 am
Posts: 4870
Location: NA East

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

DeadCellSpawn wrote:

honestly what makes shooting peoples feet where they land with a spinfusor fun?

All the more reason you're biased, and have no place giving this discussion input.

-AEnubis- wrote:

Some people have enough talent that they actually can afford to be picky about how they want to frag.

Oh yeah! The OTHER reason people self impose handicaps.

Speaking in absolutes is exaggeration to attempt to compensate for lack of logic, exemplary of the fact that "You don't know what you're talking about."

_________________

Physics | CTF Scoring | Team Selection

Sun May 06, 2012 3:38 pm

cameirus

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 10:32 am
Posts: 99

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

DeadCellSpawn wrote:

Timing
energy management
Motion prediction
Inheritance

And the epicness of a blue plate special or air mail...

Autos encourage static play, spin fusors and explosives encourage speed as they make you much more likely to survive. With autos, speed is irrelevant to a large degree.

explosive duels feel tense and on teh knife edge,

Autos are just point and click snoozefests I can get in any other FPS.

Sun May 06, 2012 5:02 pm

Varonth

Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:14 pm
Posts: 111

Re: Automatic weapon balance?

My idea to balance autos:

Reduce damage by 20% across the board.
Give medium armored classes another 20~30% damage reduction against projectile weapons.
Let the raiders shield pack take the current amount of damage.
Give heavy armored classes another 60~80% damage reduction against projectile weapons, making them basically near useless, to compensate how easy it is to hit said heavies with these weapons.

Sun May 06, 2012 6:41 pm

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Automatic weapon balance?