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Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.
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moonshus Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:31 am Posts: 14	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. This weapon definitely needs a buff or two Source: IMA guy who will float around with a heavy, get the launch notifiaction, then casually look around to see where its coming from and either A) literally walk behind a hill, or B) wait 10sec and just shoot that turtle rocket out of the d*** air. Also, why the heck does a rocket travel slower than a humanoid skipping down a hill? P.S. I don't really play DMB much, but it could definitely be a bit more of a hassle IMO
Sat May 05, 2012 1:32 am

xSNAKEx Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:43 am Posts: 33	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. hvcterr wrote: In other words, you want interruptions to "slowly rewind" the locking-progress, rather than instantly resetting it to zero? Quote: That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another. Actually, I'd like to suggest merging it with this control-scheme change: NO, Even I think this is way over powered and ridiculous, let alone the game devs You could simply be getting close to the 3 second lock mark, then quickkly move to a new target that has just become airbourne or even right behind you and fire almost immediatly without any warning to them. It comepletely ruins the balance of the weapon and changes it on a fndamental level. THis is a bad idea! hvcterr wrote: The Saber should only begin locking when you are holding the mouse button. Once this starts, it should ignore all different enemies until you release the button. Even if your original target goes behind an obstacle at the same moment another enemy moves across your screen. As soon as the lock is done, it should auto-fire the rocket immediately. You must remember to release the button at this point. This solves the "I just want to see targets, I don't want to let them know I'm around yet" problem and the "d*** stop flipping changing the target" problem and the "clickclickclickclick" problem all at once, significantly reducing frustration without (yet) introducing any balance alterations. I also completely disagree with this. The current manual target tracking (with your mouse), and auto game controlled target locking (with manual click fire after lock) is THE ONLY thing what brings some skill and fun to using the sabre. When there is multiple targets and your saber locks one for you, you must keep following that one through the crowd and heat of battle. This to me is fun and it takes some degree of skill. Also frantically clicking when close to the 3 second lock is also surprisingly/amazingly fun and does take some clicking speed skill to shoot ASAP. It sounds trivial but this is ALL the sabre has going for it in terms of fun and skill. You remove this you truly make it a 100% retard noob weapon. Actually, I think the auto locking system is quite intelligent, its just the instant terminal cancellations that are bogus. The only thing i can recommend is IT SHOULD ALSO HAVE A courtesy period if it accidentally switches target you don't want and you go back to your current one, the lock time resumes not restarts! Quote: This way there's no exploiting a "progress transfer" bug, and other enemies flying around won't "reset" your progress as it flips between targets, and the game doesn't need to keep an independent progress-counter for every single Doombrings/Enemy combination. There is no way to abuse anything as in the end you still need to hit the 3 second timer. I am just recommending its intended use works in a way that is not a clown like disgrace of a weapon.
Sat May 05, 2012 2:00 am

moonshus Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:31 am Posts: 14	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. Quote: Quote: That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another. Actually, I'd like to suggest merging it with this control-scheme change: NO, Even I think this is way over powered and ridiculous, let alone the game devs You could simply be getting close to the 3 second lock mark, then quickkly move to a new target that has just become airbourne or even right behind you and fire almost immediatly without any warning to them. It comepletely ruins the balance of the weapon and changes it on a fndamental level. THis is a bad idea! Y'all are agree'n to the same thing I reckon.
Sat May 05, 2012 2:16 am

xSNAKEx Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:43 am Posts: 33	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. Lazerus wrote: Ive only hit once with this thing. Pathfinder with our map was so d* high in the air that i could lock on him. shoot, rocket travels something about 15s, hit, kill. because im playing most of the time sentinel, rockets locked onto me are just laughable. one time nearly 20s after start someone shoot a rocket to me. i had enough time to watch it through my scope and take a perfect shot. sadly there is no medal for this^^ i dont know if you can reduce the lock on time with upgrades, but the vanilla version is way to slow. also that you always lock on jetpacking guys is frustrating. (No you cannot change anything with upgrades, it is completely as useless) haha well, Now that you mention your view of them...heres mine. I have had a SNAKE of sabres following a a shriek who was just perpetually outrunning them. IF he wanted to he could get them to hit a mountain, but he just wasn't bothered as the match would probably end before that. You don't need any skill just tap your boost to outrun em in a sabre. Pathfinders can also outrun them, and so can soldiers and even heavier for quite a long time. Yes you do need skill to outrun them, but there are so many skilled ones they can also outrun them almost forever as well as pathfinders! They need to go fast anyway to cap. I've had flag cappers take the flag, immediately be followed by a mircacle sabre that happened to lock and launch, even if if by some 2nd mircacle of the universe the sabres dont run into anything on the way to the pathfinder, the good pathfinders get home, capture the flag, go inside, change, have a d* beer, and come back out before my missile even gets close to their base. However If by now the 1000th miracle the missles do make it to and hit someone, many times I will see 450 damage and the guy just gets a nice Wooohoooo boost that actually helps them. So really the sabre could actually be considered a friendly portable, auto locking catapult to the enemy. This weapon is so far off being a concern to the operations of the way players play, i dont get why everyone is afraid of a buff. You could have a poor sentinel with 5 times the attempts and 1000x more likely chances to just instantly hit and do more damage to a airborne target at ANY stage. You would have to buff the sabre bu a huge degree before it matches that. Has anyone tried to cap a flag with 3-4 skilled sentinals snipping. It Truly is impossible! Yet you could have 16 Doombringers shooting you with sabres and it wont even matter because they wil all suck EQUALLY as much as the next. Actually they will blow themselves up they are so dumb.
Sat May 05, 2012 2:28 am

hvcterr Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:41 am Posts: 1567	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. xSNAKEx wrote: hvcterr wrote: That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another. NO, Even I think this is way over powered and ridiculous, let alone the game devs [...] THis is a bad idea! _________________ Did you know you can disable annoying signatures? Look under Board Preferences >> Edit Display Options.
Sat May 05, 2012 3:15 am

Fastidious7 Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:38 pm Posts: 59	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. xSNAKEx wrote: Also frantically clicking when close to the 3 second lock is also surprisingly/amazingly fun and does take some clicking speed skill to shoot ASAP. It sounds trivial but this is ALL the sabre has going for it in terms of fun and skill. You remove this you truly make it a 100% retard noob weapon. Actually, I think the auto locking system is quite intelligent, its just the instant terminal cancellations that are bogus. When it goes red it seems tied to ping without any client side prediction. I've been living in a hotel in Asia for the past few weeks with s*** internet (200-800ms typically) and even when I get a red lock I can still only get a shot off only a fraction of the time. When I'm at home with 30ms it's much easier to use. More of a netcode problem than anything but it definitely changes how the saber works.
Sat May 05, 2012 7:09 am

Vinson Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 7:15 pm Posts: 231	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. Good idea.
Sat May 05, 2012 8:56 am

xSNAKEx Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:43 am Posts: 33	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. hvcterr wrote: xSNAKEx wrote: hvcterr wrote: That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another. NO, Even I think this is way over powered and ridiculous, let alone the game devs [...] THis is a bad idea! lol. My mistake. I somehow read that as "can"!
Sat May 05, 2012 9:14 am

FluffyMeowington Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 7:07 pm Posts: 408 Location: yes	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. I'd like to pack my point into a question- wouldn't it be better to give the DMB something "more useful" (couldn't think of anything, to be honest, class feels so complete even without secondary), instead of promoting play with the Saber? I only got killed a single time by it, ever, and that was when it was 3:4 for the other team, I was chasing the flag-carrier who was about to cap, and I prioritized the carrier over life. That was the only time a DMB standing on a ledge somewhere, or a mountain-top, wasn't being a complete waste of space on his team. Might be completely off-base here, but is it ever a truly useful addition to the class, or the game, for that matter? If the DMB is playing the way he is supposed to, he won't get much use out of it, since most PTHs will already have disappeared behind the next mountain by the time the DMB switched weapon and locked on, no? I don't feel strongly about this either way, so take my post with a grain of salt, but it just seems counter-productive for gameplay to have the defensive class sitting somewhere (even if on the flag), with that weapon out. It doesn't really deny air-space at all, at least not for the class that gets the most out of it. P.S.: All of this is ignoring anti-vehicle, of course. For that I feel it does a good enough job, and that should stay it's main purpose imo. _________________ Rainbow-dye for T:A!
Sat May 05, 2012 9:15 am

CTCParadox Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2011 3:16 am Posts: 441	Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER. hvcterr is a genius and needs to be hired by Hi-Rez. +1 _________________ Tribes Ascend Main Classes: Juggernaut, Scraider, Doombringer, Infiltrator. 100% Inheritance. The way nature intended.
Sat May 05, 2012 9:24 am

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Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

Author

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moonshus

Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:31 am
Posts: 14

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

This weapon definitely needs a buff or two

Source: IMA guy who will float around with a heavy, get the launch notifiaction, then casually look around to see where its coming from and either A) literally walk behind a hill, or B) wait 10sec and just shoot that turtle rocket out of the d*** air.

Also, why the heck does a rocket travel slower than a humanoid skipping down a hill?

P.S. I don't really play DMB much, but it could definitely be a bit more of a hassle IMO

Sat May 05, 2012 1:32 am

xSNAKEx

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:43 am
Posts: 33

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

hvcterr wrote:

In other words, you want interruptions to "slowly rewind" the locking-progress, rather than instantly resetting it to zero?

Quote:

That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another. Actually, I'd like to suggest merging it with this control-scheme change:

NO, Even I think this is way over powered and ridiculous, let alone the game devs

You could simply be getting close to the 3 second lock mark, then quickkly move to a new target that has just become airbourne or even right behind you and fire almost immediatly without any warning to them. It comepletely ruins the balance of the weapon and changes it on a fndamental level.

THis is a bad idea!

hvcterr wrote:

The Saber should only begin locking when you are holding the mouse button.
Once this starts, it should ignore all different enemies until you release the button. Even if your original target goes behind an obstacle at the same moment another enemy moves across your screen.
As soon as the lock is done, it should auto-fire the rocket immediately. You must remember to release the button at this point.

This solves the "I just want to see targets, I don't want to let them know I'm around yet" problem and the "d*** stop flipping changing the target" problem and the "clickclickclickclick" problem all at once, significantly reducing frustration without (yet) introducing any balance alterations.

I also completely disagree with this. The current manual target tracking (with your mouse), and auto game controlled target locking (with manual click fire after lock) is THE ONLY thing what brings some skill and fun to using the sabre.

When there is multiple targets and your saber locks one for you, you must keep following that one through the crowd and heat of battle. This to me is fun and it takes some degree of skill. Also frantically clicking when close to the 3 second lock is also surprisingly/amazingly fun and does take some clicking speed skill to shoot ASAP. It sounds trivial but this is ALL the sabre has going for it in terms of fun and skill. You remove this you truly make it a 100% retard noob weapon. Actually, I think the auto locking system is quite intelligent, its just the instant terminal cancellations that are bogus.

The only thing i can recommend is IT SHOULD ALSO HAVE A courtesy period if it accidentally switches target you don't want and you go back to your current one, the lock time resumes not restarts!

Quote:

This way there's no exploiting a "progress transfer" bug, and other enemies flying around won't "reset" your progress as it flips between targets, and the game doesn't need to keep an independent progress-counter for every single Doombrings/Enemy combination.

There is no way to abuse anything as in the end you still need to hit the 3 second timer. I am just recommending its intended use works in a way that is not a clown like disgrace of a weapon.

Sat May 05, 2012 2:00 am

moonshus

Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:31 am
Posts: 14

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

Quote:

Quote:
That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another. Actually, I'd like to suggest merging it with this control-scheme change:

NO, Even I think this is way over powered and ridiculous, let alone the game devs You could simply be getting close to the 3 second lock mark, then quickkly move to a new target that has just become airbourne or even right behind you and fire almost immediatly without any warning to them. It comepletely ruins the balance of the weapon and changes it on a fndamental level.

THis is a bad idea!

Y'all are agree'n to the same thing I reckon.

Sat May 05, 2012 2:16 am

xSNAKEx

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:43 am
Posts: 33

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

Lazerus wrote:

Ive only hit once with this thing.
Pathfinder with our map was so d*** high in the air that i could lock on him. shoot, rocket travels something about 15s, hit, kill.

because im playing most of the time sentinel, rockets locked onto me are just laughable.
one time nearly 20s after start someone shoot a rocket to me.
i had enough time to watch it through my scope and take a perfect shot.
sadly there is no medal for this^^

i dont know if you can reduce the lock on time with upgrades, but the vanilla version is way to slow.
also that you always lock on jetpacking guys is frustrating.

(No you cannot change anything with upgrades, it is completely as useless)

haha well, Now that you mention your view of them...heres mine.

I have had a SNAKE of sabres following a a shriek who was just perpetually outrunning them. IF he wanted to he could get them to hit a mountain, but he just wasn't bothered as the match would probably end before that. You don't need any skill just tap your boost to outrun em in a sabre.
Pathfinders can also outrun them, and so can soldiers and even heavier for quite a long time. Yes you do need skill to outrun them, but there are so many skilled ones they can also outrun them almost forever as well as pathfinders! They need to go fast anyway to cap.

I've had flag cappers take the flag, immediately be followed by a mircacle sabre that happened to lock and launch, even if if by some 2nd mircacle of the universe the sabres dont run into anything on the way to the pathfinder, the good pathfinders get home, capture the flag, go inside, change, have a d*** beer, and come back out before my missile even gets close to their base.

However If by now the 1000th miracle the missles do make it to and hit someone, many times I will see 450 damage and the guy just gets a nice Wooohoooo boost that actually helps them.

So really the sabre could actually be considered a friendly portable, auto locking catapult to the enemy.

This weapon is so far off being a concern to the operations of the way players play, i dont get why everyone is afraid of a buff. You could have a poor sentinel with 5 times the attempts and 1000x more likely chances to just instantly hit and do more damage to a airborne target at ANY stage. You would have to buff the sabre bu a huge degree before it matches that.

Has anyone tried to cap a flag with 3-4 skilled sentinals snipping. It Truly is impossible!

Yet you could have 16 Doombringers shooting you with sabres and it wont even matter because they wil all suck EQUALLY as much as the next. Actually they will blow themselves up they are so dumb.

Sat May 05, 2012 2:28 am

hvcterr

Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:41 am
Posts: 1567

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

xSNAKEx wrote:

hvcterr wrote:

That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another.

NO, Even I think this is way over powered and ridiculous, let alone the game devs

[...]
THis is a bad idea!

_________________
Did you know you can disable annoying signatures? Look under Board Preferences >> Edit Display Options.

Sat May 05, 2012 3:15 am

Fastidious7

Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:38 pm
Posts: 59

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

xSNAKEx wrote:

Also frantically clicking when close to the 3 second lock is also surprisingly/amazingly fun and does take some clicking speed skill to shoot ASAP. It sounds trivial but this is ALL the sabre has going for it in terms of fun and skill. You remove this you truly make it a 100% retard noob weapon. Actually, I think the auto locking system is quite intelligent, its just the instant terminal cancellations that are bogus.

When it goes red it seems tied to ping without any client side prediction. I've been living in a hotel in Asia for the past few weeks with s*** internet (200-800ms typically) and even when I get a red lock I can still only get a shot off only a fraction of the time. When I'm at home with 30ms it's much easier to use. More of a netcode problem than anything but it definitely changes how the saber works.

Sat May 05, 2012 7:09 am

Vinson

Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2011 7:15 pm
Posts: 231

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

Good idea.

Sat May 05, 2012 8:56 am

xSNAKEx

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:43 am
Posts: 33

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

hvcterr wrote:

xSNAKEx wrote:

hvcterr wrote:

That sounds good, as long as the timings are tweaked a bit and you can't "transfer" locking-progress from one enemy to another.

NO, Even I think this is way over powered and ridiculous, let alone the game devs

[...]
THis is a bad idea!

lol. My mistake. I somehow read that as "can"!

Sat May 05, 2012 9:14 am

FluffyMeowington

Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 7:07 pm
Posts: 408
Location: yes

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

I'd like to pack my point into a question- wouldn't it be better to give the DMB something "more useful" (couldn't think of anything, to be honest, class feels so complete even without secondary), instead of promoting play with the Saber?

I only got killed a single time by it, ever, and that was when it was 3:4 for the other team, I was chasing the flag-carrier who was about to cap, and I prioritized the carrier over life. That was the only time a DMB standing on a ledge somewhere, or a mountain-top, wasn't being a complete waste of space on his team.

Might be completely off-base here, but is it ever a truly useful addition to the class, or the game, for that matter? If the DMB is playing the way he is supposed to, he won't get much use out of it, since most PTHs will already have disappeared behind the next mountain by the time the DMB switched weapon and locked on, no?

I don't feel strongly about this either way, so take my post with a grain of salt, but it just seems counter-productive for gameplay to have the defensive class sitting somewhere (even if on the flag), with that weapon out. It doesn't really deny air-space at all, at least not for the class that gets the most out of it.

P.S.: All of this is ignoring anti-vehicle, of course. For that I feel it does a good enough job, and that should stay it's main purpose imo.

_________________

Rainbow-dye for T:A!

Sat May 05, 2012 9:15 am

CTCParadox

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2011 3:16 am
Posts: 441

Re: Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.

hvcterr is a genius and needs to be hired by Hi-Rez.

+1

_________________
Tribes Ascend Main Classes: Juggernaut, Scraider, Doombringer, Infiltrator.
100% Inheritance. The way nature intended.

Sat May 05, 2012 9:24 am

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Whats wrong with this? TWO WAY TIMER FOR THE SABER LAUNCHER.