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Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?
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Punichan Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:46 am Posts: 452	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? There are Rarely rounds with over time/no caps, but there are TONS of rounds with less than 5 minutes, 5-0 games... that can only mean 2 things... stacking players, and the other team AFK completely, and Capping is unstoppable, there is not enough counters for... The fact is that HiSpeedCap is automatic "home run"... it shouldn't be that way.. Face it, Defense in this game is a joke, Paper Toy Turrets, Low health wall, counter HoF buff/perks, easy base rape (and now with the $Super Raider$, it's even easier), finally, Bloody strike ($$$=INSTA CAP) where capper can cap WHILE THE STRIKE IS GOING OFF AT THE FLAG STAND!~ you can't tell me defending is hard unless you are just a capper who trained VERY HARD on 1-2 routes per map, and expect to have no obstacles when setting up a hi-speed cap.. again, I didn't say Nerf cappers, I only say "while having flag, using boost/jet/ski will require tad more skill to pull off super sonic" (thereby giving the Chaser an actual job to look forward to. and shut those people up about flying capping no skill talk, it benefits all sides! What do you think forced shrike defense?
Tue May 01, 2012 8:22 pm

irimi Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:37 am Posts: 478	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? Punichan wrote: There are Rarely rounds with over time/no caps, but there are TONS of rounds with less than 5 minutes, 5-0 games... that can only mean 2 things... stacking players bingo
Tue May 01, 2012 8:23 pm

fac3nade Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:15 am Posts: 1145	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? Nuggetman wrote: irimi wrote: fac3nade wrote: the solution is already in the game. thrust pack. it needs a buff. instant 200kph. Sorry, this is a poor solution. Thrust Pack shouldn't be "press for insta high speed" for unskilled players who don't know how to ski. Kinda have to agree here it's a solution for chasing fast grabs, not for 'unskilled players who don't know how to ski'. jeez, pay attention. Nuggetman wrote: fac3nade wrote: if someone grabs at 350 you're not supposed to catch him. end of story. you failed at flag d. Also how can you even say this with things like tactical strikes and oribitals in the game. valid point is valid. i won't try to argue that, the strikes are miserable. they're supposed to be a fun tool for pubs, but they really only benefit this small elite group of dedicated pub stompers and ruin everything for the casual players _________________
Tue May 01, 2012 9:22 pm

Punichan Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:46 am Posts: 452	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? To put this simple... I have not problems with cappers, I respect their skill, just don't think it should be auto win when they actually performed a "speedcap"... Speed Cap is a skill, I do not want to take that away, and I do NOT want to nerf it so that anyone can catch up to them, I didn't ask for Speed cap(meaning: maximum speed that can't exceed), Nor did I ask for disabling ANY speed booster techniques (such as rocket/nade/boost/perk/load out)... All I ask is to add a few pounds on the carrier "AFTER HE/SHE PICK UP THE FLAG" (here, I didn't even want to say drop speed up on pick up, right?) fairly saying "speed capping" will get a capper in/out of enemies' base quick, but what it should NOT be is an AUTO-HOME-RUN; YOU ARE NOT HOME FREE WHEN YOU "START" THAT RUN! I didn't say (painful when you have flag; you loose leg/ Jet pack leaks gas/ have to walk up hill/ booster no work/ health don't gen/ nade WILL AUTO KILL YOU...Etc NO! NONE OF THAT! because I DO RESPECT CAPPERS! (because I did it before, and know how hard is to set one up and how easy and pissed off I was when a shrike/wall/mine/Fatso/rock/tank/bike/tree/turrets/mortar/pillar can TOTALLY RUIN my ENTIRE EFFORT, turning my AWESOME CAP in to lama/E cap... but I DO NOT think getting in to my 250MPH speed and grabbing that flag is victory, IT'S ONLY THE BANNING, I have to make the run for it... RUNNING AND GUNNING IS THE TRUE CAPPER'S GAME! NOT JUST the slide and grab... This game however... untrue, you see, the best capper/chaser IS the same Jedi (pathfinder) class... the only differences are who attacks first... in our case Capper gets head start, and usually a VERY GOOD START (in the middel of a strike/base rape) once the capper have that flag at 300MPH, it's gone for good, he/she will fly streight home, some even cares less about sabers... they can actually touch down B4 the saber takes their life! Chasing is a crap job in this game... because you have almost NO chance unless the capper makes a mistake, or you "magic shot" them... most of the time, because they are so much ahead... it won't do jack even if you lay a few hits... All I ask is a fair chance to chase, stop the god awful 1-3 man game, if HiRez wants this to be a TEAM EFFORT... and not "Who ever got the Pro Cappers wins!" (CTF should then be called LTC;Lobby That Capper) I just (again, NOT ASKING FOR MAJOR HANDICAP) want the flag to weight, so that they will have to use tad more energy to boost/jet, and they will have tad more speed reduction when going up hill, and less knock back when being hit/concussion jumps... plus going on absolute flat WILL (very) slightly drop speed... This is only done to allow the slower reacting chasers to have chance to catch up, making Flag pass/perks&loadout choice, harder skill/learning curve for the cappers... In return, game play WILL BE MORE CHALLENGING, and cappers who ARE already good will stay good, but still have some kinks to punch out, and NO CHASERS WILL EVER b**** ABOUT cappers going light speed, because now, they ACTUALLY HAVE AN EDGE! see... it benefits both sides!
Wed May 02, 2012 12:51 am

SkepticTA Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2010 7:41 pm Posts: 3062	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? The solution is in level design. Back caps need to be blocked by gen-dependent obstacles so that if you don't want the other team capping all over you, you'll defend your gen. If you ignore it, your flag will never be at home. This doesn't have to be the way on all maps, on some you can block it off entirely (like raindance) or put the base turrets in positions most threatening to back cappers. This is such a basic thing that I can't believe it isn't already done. It would be a fair game where the best balanced team will cap. _________________ (AHK) T:A Physics Profiler
Wed May 02, 2012 1:04 am

irimi Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:37 am Posts: 478	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? fac3nade wrote: irimi wrote: fac3nade wrote: the solution is already in the game. thrust pack. it needs a buff. instant 200kph. Sorry, this is a poor solution. Thrust Pack shouldn't be "press for insta high speed" for unskilled players who don't know how to ski. it's a solution for chasing fast grabs, not for 'unskilled players who don't know how to ski'. jeez, pay attention. Of course, I'm not saying that you're proposing something for unskilled players who don't know how to ski. But the point is, that's essentially what your proposal creates. Better to buff disc/nitron jumps in a way that doesn't benefit cappers, like this thread.
Wed May 02, 2012 1:09 am

BAITness Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:25 pm Posts: 69	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? Another solution would be intelligent flag placement... if the chaser is starting with a full energy pack and the capper with none it takes a lot of the capper's advantage away. A little too late to do that with current maps, unfortunately.
Wed May 02, 2012 1:17 am

DrEuthanasia Beta Tester Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 5:20 pm Posts: 1101	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? How to chase SANIC HEGEHOG? Well, if a heavy can do it...
Wed May 02, 2012 1:33 am

RandallPotter Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2011 1:33 am Posts: 335 Location: Atlanta, GA	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? Ibin... can catch me and others just fine. Here's a loadout: Pathfinder. Rage Perk. Ultra Capacitor. Thrust pack. Nitron. A method to catch sanic: Stand near flag when it's grabbed, while red electricity is flowing on you ( Raged ) - thrust pack once, into a nitron jump, instant 200+ speeds. You'll also have enough health for a disc jump, but that will leave you with low health. This method can catch most people on the public servers. Be careful how you choose your route, try to intercept but not overshoot. Also choose your shots. I know the minimum delay between spinfusor shots. Just when I know the delay is up and they are going to shoot, I strafe or change direction. Most people just shoot as quick as they can at the capper. I use that to my advantage. In my opinion it's a skill gap and matchmaking issue versus game mechanics. One day I just asked Ibin how he does it and he shared with me. So good call asking. _________________ When I'm not beta testing I'm playing TribesNext on the GoonHaven servers. Cyborg27X-A CEO, GraceFruit Media, LLC. Atlanta, GA Interactive. Marketing. Strategy. http://www.RandallPotter.com
Wed May 02, 2012 1:44 am

Punichan Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:46 am Posts: 452	Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC? SkepticTA wrote: The solution is in level design. Back caps need to be blocked by gen-dependent obstacles so that if you don't want the other team capping all over you, you'll defend your gen. If you ignore it, your flag will never be at home. This doesn't have to be the way on all maps, on some you can block it off entirely (like raindance) or put the base turrets in positions most threatening to back cappers. This is such a basic thing that I can't believe it isn't already done. It would be a fair game where the best balanced team will cap. You don't mean the paper turrets... do you? RandallPotter wrote: Ibin... can catch me and others just fine. Here's a loadout: Pathfinder. Rage Perk. Ultra Capacitor. Thrust pack. Nitron. A method to catch sanic: Stand near flag when it's grabbed, while red electricity is flowing on you ( Raged ) - thrust pack once, into a nitron jump, instant 200+ speeds. You'll also have enough health for a disc jump, but that will leave you with low health. This method can catch most people on the public servers. Be careful how you choose your route, try to intercept but not overshoot. Also choose your shots. I know the minimum delay between spinfusor shots. Just when I know the delay is up and they are going to shoot, I strafe or change direction. Most people just shoot as quick as they can at the capper. I use that to my advantage. In my opinion it's a skill gap and matchmaking issue versus game mechanics. One day I just asked Ibin how he does it and he shared with me. So good call asking. "..close to flag..." baserape/strike FTW? Except for the brave HoFs... nobody wants to stand on flag stand, or anywhere near it, because it's center of attentions/and bullet magnet... you wan to sit near flag? light? yeah right... good luck when strike happens! especially now days, with the raiders getting 10-20 frags in the first 5 min of the game.. strike/shrike can happen early now...
Wed May 02, 2012 1:16 pm

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Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

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Punichan

Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:46 am
Posts: 452

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

There are Rarely rounds with over time/no caps, but there are TONS of rounds with less than 5 minutes, 5-0 games... that can only mean 2 things... stacking players, and the other team AFK completely, and Capping is unstoppable, there is not enough counters for... The fact is that HiSpeedCap is automatic "home run"... it shouldn't be that way..

Face it, Defense in this game is a joke, Paper Toy Turrets, Low health wall, counter HoF buff/perks, easy base rape (and now with the $Super Raider$, it's even easier), finally, Bloody strike ($$$=INSTA CAP) where capper can cap WHILE THE STRIKE IS GOING OFF AT THE FLAG STAND!~ you can't tell me defending is hard unless you are just a capper who trained VERY HARD on 1-2 routes per map, and expect to have no obstacles when setting up a hi-speed cap..

again, I didn't say Nerf cappers, I only say "while having flag, using boost/jet/ski will require tad more skill to pull off super sonic" (thereby giving the Chaser an actual job to look forward to. and shut those people up about flying capping no skill talk, it benefits all sides! What do you think forced shrike defense?

Tue May 01, 2012 8:22 pm

irimi

Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:37 am
Posts: 478

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

Punichan wrote:

There are Rarely rounds with over time/no caps, but there are TONS of rounds with less than 5 minutes, 5-0 games... that can only mean 2 things... stacking players

bingo

Tue May 01, 2012 8:23 pm

fac3nade

Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:15 am
Posts: 1145

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

Nuggetman wrote:

irimi wrote:

fac3nade wrote:

the solution is already in the game. thrust pack. it needs a buff. instant 200kph.

Sorry, this is a poor solution. Thrust Pack shouldn't be "press for insta high speed" for unskilled players who don't know how to ski.

Kinda have to agree here

it's a solution for chasing fast grabs, not for 'unskilled players who don't know how to ski'. jeez, pay attention.

Nuggetman wrote:

fac3nade wrote:

if someone grabs at 350 you're not supposed to catch him. end of story. you failed at flag d.

Also how can you even say this with things like tactical strikes and oribitals in the game.

valid point is valid. i won't try to argue that, the strikes are miserable. they're supposed to be a fun tool for pubs, but they really only benefit this small elite group of dedicated pub stompers and ruin everything for the casual players

_________________

Tue May 01, 2012 9:22 pm

Punichan

Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:46 am
Posts: 452

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

To put this simple...
I have not problems with cappers, I respect their skill, just don't think it should be auto win when they actually performed a "speedcap"...

Speed Cap is a skill, I do not want to take that away, and I do NOT want to nerf it so that anyone can catch up to them, I didn't ask for Speed cap(meaning: maximum speed that can't exceed), Nor did I ask for disabling ANY speed booster techniques (such as rocket/nade/boost/perk/load out)... All I ask is to add a few pounds on the carrier "AFTER HE/SHE PICK UP THE FLAG" (here, I didn't even want to say drop speed up on pick up, right?) fairly saying "speed capping" will get a capper in/out of enemies' base quick, but what it should NOT be is an AUTO-HOME-RUN; YOU ARE NOT HOME FREE WHEN YOU "START" THAT RUN! I didn't say (painful when you have flag; you loose leg/ Jet pack leaks gas/ have to walk up hill/ booster no work/ health don't gen/ nade WILL AUTO KILL YOU...Etc NO! NONE OF THAT! because I DO RESPECT CAPPERS! (because I did it before, and know how hard is to set one up and how easy and pissed off I was when a shrike/wall/mine/Fatso/rock/tank/bike/tree/turrets/mortar/pillar can TOTALLY RUIN my ENTIRE EFFORT, turning my AWESOME CAP in to lama/E cap... but I DO NOT think getting in to my 250MPH speed and grabbing that flag is victory, IT'S ONLY THE BANNING, I have to make the run for it... RUNNING AND GUNNING IS THE TRUE CAPPER'S GAME! NOT JUST the slide and grab...

This game however... untrue, you see, the best capper/chaser IS the same Jedi (pathfinder) class... the only differences are who attacks first... in our case Capper gets head start, and usually a VERY GOOD START (in the middel of a strike/base rape) once the capper have that flag at 300MPH, it's gone for good, he/she will fly streight home, some even cares less about sabers... they can actually touch down B4 the saber takes their life! Chasing is a crap job in this game... because you have almost NO chance unless the capper makes a mistake, or you "magic shot" them... most of the time, because they are so much ahead... it won't do jack even if you lay a few hits...

All I ask is a fair chance to chase, stop the god awful 1-3 man game, if HiRez wants this to be a TEAM EFFORT... and not "Who ever got the Pro Cappers wins!" (CTF should then be called LTC;Lobby That Capper) I just (again, NOT ASKING FOR MAJOR HANDICAP) want the flag to weight, so that they will have to use tad more energy to boost/jet, and they will have tad more speed reduction when going up hill, and less knock back when being hit/concussion jumps... plus going on absolute flat WILL (very) slightly drop speed... This is only done to allow the slower reacting chasers to have chance to catch up, making Flag pass/perks&loadout choice, harder skill/learning curve for the cappers...

In return, game play WILL BE MORE CHALLENGING, and cappers who ARE already good will stay good, but still have some kinks to punch out, and NO CHASERS WILL EVER b**** ABOUT cappers going light speed, because now, they ACTUALLY HAVE AN EDGE! see... it benefits both sides!

Wed May 02, 2012 12:51 am

SkepticTA

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2010 7:41 pm
Posts: 3062

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

The solution is in level design. Back caps need to be blocked by gen-dependent obstacles so that if you don't want the other team capping all over you, you'll defend your gen. If you ignore it, your flag will never be at home. This doesn't have to be the way on all maps, on some you can block it off entirely (like raindance) or put the base turrets in positions most threatening to back cappers.

This is such a basic thing that I can't believe it isn't already done. It would be a fair game where the best balanced team will cap.

_________________

(AHK) T:A Physics Profiler

Wed May 02, 2012 1:04 am

irimi

Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:37 am
Posts: 478

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

fac3nade wrote:

irimi wrote:

fac3nade wrote:

the solution is already in the game. thrust pack. it needs a buff. instant 200kph.

Sorry, this is a poor solution. Thrust Pack shouldn't be "press for insta high speed" for unskilled players who don't know how to ski.

it's a solution for chasing fast grabs, not for 'unskilled players who don't know how to ski'. jeez, pay attention.

Of course, I'm not saying that you're proposing something for unskilled players who don't know how to ski. But the point is, that's essentially what your proposal creates.

Better to buff disc/nitron jumps in a way that doesn't benefit cappers, like this thread.

Wed May 02, 2012 1:09 am

BAITness

Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:25 pm
Posts: 69

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

Another solution would be intelligent flag placement... if the chaser is starting with a full energy pack and the capper with none it takes a lot of the capper's advantage away.

A little too late to do that with current maps, unfortunately.

Wed May 02, 2012 1:17 am

DrEuthanasia

Beta Tester

Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 5:20 pm
Posts: 1101

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

How to chase SANIC HEGEHOG?

Well, if a heavy can do it...

Wed May 02, 2012 1:33 am

RandallPotter

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2011 1:33 am
Posts: 335
Location: Atlanta, GA

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

Ibin... can catch me and others just fine.

Here's a loadout:
Pathfinder. Rage Perk. Ultra Capacitor. Thrust pack. Nitron.

A method to catch sanic:
Stand near flag when it's grabbed, while red electricity is flowing on you ( Raged ) - thrust pack once, into a nitron jump, instant 200+ speeds. You'll also have enough health for a disc jump, but that will leave you with low health. This method can catch most people on the public servers.

Be careful how you choose your route, try to intercept but not overshoot.
Also choose your shots. I know the minimum delay between spinfusor shots. Just when I know the delay is up and they are going to shoot, I strafe or change direction. Most people just shoot as quick as they can at the capper. I use that to my advantage.

In my opinion it's a skill gap and matchmaking issue versus game mechanics.

One day I just asked Ibin how he does it and he shared with me. So good call asking.

_________________
When I'm not beta testing I'm playing TribesNext on the GoonHaven servers.
Cyborg27X-A
CEO, GraceFruit Media, LLC. Atlanta, GA
Interactive. Marketing. Strategy.
http://www.RandallPotter.com

Wed May 02, 2012 1:44 am

Punichan

Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:46 am
Posts: 452

Re: Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?

SkepticTA wrote:

You don't mean the paper turrets... do you?

RandallPotter wrote:

"..close to flag..." baserape/strike FTW? Except for the brave HoFs... nobody wants to stand on flag stand, or anywhere near it, because it's center of attentions/and bullet magnet... you wan to sit near flag? light? yeah right... good luck when strike happens! especially now days, with the raiders getting 10-20 frags in the first 5 min of the game.. strike/shrike can happen early now...

Wed May 02, 2012 1:16 pm

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Question to HiRez: How to chase SANIC?