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ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?
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Alpherior Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm Posts: 266 Location: Ontario, Canada	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? Morgul1975 wrote: Unlocking the Colt didn't feel like it was anywhere close to a viable replacement for the Auto Shotgun. Generally when I unlock something it's at least worth trying out. I didn't find that to be the case with this particular weapon. I can say it was surely intended to be a finishing weapon LIKE the shotgun, but sacrificing ease of use for range -- sadly, it's just so hard to work with. _________________ Main Class: Brute (Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)
Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:30 pm

DibbzTheLoner Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am Posts: 1616 Location: Australia Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? Alpherior wrote: Morgul1975 wrote: Unlocking the Colt didn't feel like it was anywhere close to a viable replacement for the Auto Shotgun. Generally when I unlock something it's at least worth trying out. I didn't find that to be the case with this particular weapon. I can say it was surely intended to be a finishing weapon LIKE the shotgun, but sacrificing ease of use for range -- sadly, it's just so hard to work with. Mm, very very difficult to line up shots properly, and its range isn't actually that far, within 2 seconds of a pathfinder shooting past you he's already too far away to hit even with an aimbot. And the Colt really isn't competitive with automatics at any range, and even a bullet-duel between you (a heavy) versus a medium will end with you dead unless you are fortunate enough to be duelling against someone so poor in skill that you look like an MLG champion in comparison. Alpherior wrote: DibbzTheLoner wrote: I enjoy playing the Brute class, but from my constant duelling with Juggernaut players of similar skill level I can say that the Brute really is about equal in ability to the Jugg for spinfusor duelling, while the Jugg can also use mortars which gives them a huge amount more use. A Jugg with the Spinfusor Mk and throwable Spinfusor Disks is equal in duelling potency to a Brute with the Heavy Spinfusor and extra Energy, which kind of defeats the purpose of the Brute's existence. I do agree with this thread, and these are my personal preferences for balance: Heavy Spinfusor: --Increase direct hit and splash damage --DPS needs to be more comparable to the Soldier's Spinfusor, the Heavy Spinfusor's DPS is currently very strangely low compared to most other Spinfusors in the game. --Make the projectile art for the disk larger to match its power and make it look nicer Automatic Shotgun: --Pretty well balanced, could use 1-2 metres longer range to help you harass airborne enemies and delay their regeneration. Nova Colt: --Increase base damage slightly (by another 10 or so), to make up for how extremely difficult it often is to line up shots --Reduce damage drop-off very slightly so that it can compete with other bullet weapons at long ranges Fractal Grenade: --Reduce time between fragment bursts by 50%, increase the number of fragment bursts by 100%, decrease damage per fragment burst by 50%, reduce the knockback of fragment bursts by 50%. --This is not a buff or nerf, this is just to make it more consistent instead of so heavily reliant on random chance. Energy Pack: --Swap one or two of the +5 Energy upgrades for a +5% Energy Regen upgrade, to make the class more mobile at all times, instead of just more mobile after sitting still for ages --If you've already wasted all your Energy you're no more mobile than a DMB or JUG, which slightly defeats the purpose of the Brute. Granting a small amount of Energy Regen in this pack will make the Brute more agile, which it needs to make a use for itself beyond what the JUG can do --The max energy barely matters, as the amount you can use is more determined by energy regen since you'll spend most of the game at around 50% capacity anyway, making you no more agile than other Heavies. Heavy Shield Pack: --This pack currently has the shortest duration of any activated pack in the game, it could use a slightly reduced energy cost, as the extremely slow energy regen of the Brute already causes it to have very long downtime. This. Thankyou ^^ _________________ This signature is green. I like the colour green. Wait, why are you still reading? It should be obvious that this signature is pointless and just here to be green. Stop reading already! You're procrastinating too much!
Wed Apr 04, 2012 5:22 am

Alpherior Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm Posts: 266 Location: Ontario, Canada	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? Well, the Nova Colt actually isn't an automatic weapon -- it fires per click... Still, for it to compete it may need a larger clip and automatic firing... Which I don't know if it will happen because you can clearly see on the weapon that it's physical clip is 6... _________________ Main Class: Brute (Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)
Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:15 am

DibbzTheLoner Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am Posts: 1616 Location: Australia Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? Alpherior wrote: Well, the Nova Colt actually isn't an automatic weapon -- it fires per click... Still, for it to compete it may need a larger clip and automatic firing... Which I don't know if it will happen because you can clearly see on the weapon that it's physical clip is 6... ^Competing =/= working identically..... No duh it's not automatic, that has nothing to do with anything... nobody implied that it needs be automatic or have a larger clip; the whole concept of the thing is that it's a magnum 6-shooter. As the OP suggested, making the "bullet size" large would help with how incredibly difficult it is to aim (I've halved my sensitivity to try to get it to be more accurate, but it's still near impossible to use so all I've really done is thrown off my spinfusor aim :/) If that's not possible on a hit scan weapon, maybe make it projectile-based with a very very high speed, then it can have as big a bullet as necessary. (plus it'll look cool ) _________________ This signature is green. I like the colour green. Wait, why are you still reading? It should be obvious that this signature is pointless and just here to be green. Stop reading already! You're procrastinating too much!
Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:48 am

Alpherior Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm Posts: 266 Location: Ontario, Canada	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? DibbzTheLoner wrote: Alpherior wrote: Well, the Nova Colt actually isn't an automatic weapon -- it fires per click... Still, for it to compete it may need a larger clip and automatic firing... Which I don't know if it will happen because you can clearly see on the weapon that it's physical clip is 6... ^Competing =/= working identically..... No duh it's not automatic, that has nothing to do with anything... nobody implied that it needs be automatic or have a larger clip; the whole concept of the thing is that it's a magnum 6-shooter. As the OP suggested, making the "bullet size" large would help with how incredibly difficult it is to aim (I've halved my sensitivity to try to get it to be more accurate, but it's still near impossible to use so all I've really done is thrown off my spinfusor aim :/) If that's not possible on a hit scan weapon, maybe make it projectile-based with a very very high speed, then it can have as big a bullet as necessary. (plus it'll look cool ) Yeah, you're probably right. Why make it more automatic/rapid fire when its supposed to be a 6shooter? I'd probably rather a bigger hitbox/more damage more anyways. P.S. ... I'm the OP. _________________ Main Class: Brute (Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)
Wed Apr 04, 2012 3:28 pm

111uminate Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 7:10 am Posts: 387 Steam Gamer Name: WhiteCrow	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? Agreed. Brute definitely needs some new toys and we'll get them eventually, but I don't know how open they are to the idea of tweaking his current kit options. I really would love to see the HSF receive at least one more change for the better. _________________ IGN: WhiteCrow (Yeah, I'm that guy.) HiRezTodd wrote: Data-porn!
Wed Apr 04, 2012 3:37 pm

Alpherior Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm Posts: 266 Location: Ontario, Canada	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? 111uminate wrote: Agreed. Brute definitely needs some new toys and we'll get them eventually, but I don't know how open they are to the idea of tweaking his current kit options. I really would love to see the HSF receive at least one more change for the better. I seriously hope the next patch or close to next patch is Brute-specific. _________________ Main Class: Brute (Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)
Wed Apr 04, 2012 8:46 pm

DibbzTheLoner Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am Posts: 1616 Location: Australia Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? Alpherior wrote: P.S. ... I'm the OP. .....dammit >.< Set a profile picture or something man, trying to recognise people by name alone on forums is very difficult :/ _________________ This signature is green. I like the colour green. Wait, why are you still reading? It should be obvious that this signature is pointless and just here to be green. Stop reading already! You're procrastinating too much!
Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:12 pm

Alpherior Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm Posts: 266 Location: Ontario, Canada	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? DibbzTheLoner wrote: Alpherior wrote: P.S. ... I'm the OP. .....dammit >.< Set a profile picture or something man, trying to recognize people by name alone on forums is very difficult :/ How has this not occured to me yet... Setting one now. _________________ Main Class: Brute (Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)
Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:15 pm

Alpherior Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm Posts: 266 Location: Ontario, Canada	Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment? ... Got my wicked picture now. Now I can push for Brute buffs with a visual identity. _________________ Main Class: Brute (Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)
Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:33 pm

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ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

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Alpherior

Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm
Posts: 266
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

Morgul1975 wrote:

Unlocking the Colt didn't feel like it was anywhere close to a viable replacement for the Auto Shotgun. Generally when I unlock something it's at least worth trying out. I didn't find that to be the case with this particular weapon.

I can say it was surely intended to be a finishing weapon LIKE the shotgun, but sacrificing ease of use for range -- sadly, it's just so hard to work with.

_________________

Main Class: Brute
(Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)

Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:30 pm

DibbzTheLoner

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am
Posts: 1616
Location: Australia
Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

Alpherior wrote:

Morgul1975 wrote:

I can say it was surely intended to be a finishing weapon LIKE the shotgun, but sacrificing ease of use for range -- sadly, it's just so hard to work with.

Mm, very very difficult to line up shots properly, and its range isn't actually that far, within 2 seconds of a pathfinder shooting past you he's already too far away to hit even with an aimbot.

And the Colt really isn't competitive with automatics at any range, and even a bullet-duel between you (a heavy) versus a medium will end with you dead unless you are fortunate enough to be duelling against someone so poor in skill that you look like an MLG champion in comparison.

Alpherior wrote:

DibbzTheLoner wrote:

I enjoy playing the Brute class, but from my constant duelling with Juggernaut players of similar skill level I can say that the Brute really is about equal in ability to the Jugg for spinfusor duelling, while the Jugg can also use mortars which gives them a huge amount more use.
A Jugg with the Spinfusor Mk and throwable Spinfusor Disks is equal in duelling potency to a Brute with the Heavy Spinfusor and extra Energy, which kind of defeats the purpose of the Brute's existence.

I do agree with this thread, and these are my personal preferences for balance:

Heavy Spinfusor:
--Increase direct hit and splash damage
--DPS needs to be more comparable to the Soldier's Spinfusor, the Heavy Spinfusor's DPS is currently very strangely low compared to most other Spinfusors in the game.
--Make the projectile art for the disk larger to match its power and make it look nicer

Automatic Shotgun:
--Pretty well balanced, could use 1-2 metres longer range to help you harass airborne enemies and delay their regeneration.

Nova Colt:
--Increase base damage slightly (by another 10 or so), to make up for how extremely difficult it often is to line up shots
--Reduce damage drop-off very slightly so that it can compete with other bullet weapons at long ranges

Fractal Grenade:
--Reduce time between fragment bursts by 50%, increase the number of fragment bursts by 100%, decrease damage per fragment burst by 50%, reduce the knockback of fragment bursts by 50%.
--This is not a buff or nerf, this is just to make it more consistent instead of so heavily reliant on random chance.

Energy Pack:
--Swap one or two of the +5 Energy upgrades for a +5% Energy Regen upgrade, to make the class more mobile at all times, instead of just more mobile after sitting still for ages
--If you've already wasted all your Energy you're no more mobile than a DMB or JUG, which slightly defeats the purpose of the Brute. Granting a small amount of Energy Regen in this pack will make the Brute more agile, which it needs to make a use for itself beyond what the JUG can do
--The max energy barely matters, as the amount you can use is more determined by energy regen since you'll spend most of the game at around 50% capacity anyway, making you no more agile than other Heavies.

Heavy Shield Pack:
--This pack currently has the shortest duration of any activated pack in the game, it could use a slightly reduced energy cost, as the extremely slow energy regen of the Brute already causes it to have very long downtime.

This.

Thankyou ^^

_________________
This signature is green. I like the colour green.
Wait, why are you still reading? It should be obvious that this signature is pointless and just here to be green.
Stop reading already! You're procrastinating too much!

Wed Apr 04, 2012 5:22 am

Alpherior

Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm
Posts: 266
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

Well, the Nova Colt actually isn't an automatic weapon -- it fires per click... Still, for it to compete it may need a larger clip and automatic firing...

Which I don't know if it will happen because you can clearly see on the weapon that it's physical clip is 6...

_________________

Main Class: Brute
(Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)

Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:15 am

DibbzTheLoner

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am
Posts: 1616
Location: Australia
Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

Alpherior wrote:

^Competing =/= working identically.....

No duh it's not automatic, that has nothing to do with anything... nobody implied that it needs be automatic or have a larger clip; the whole concept of the thing is that it's a magnum 6-shooter.

As the OP suggested, making the "bullet size" large would help with how incredibly difficult it is to aim (I've halved my sensitivity to try to get it to be more accurate, but it's still near impossible to use so all I've really done is thrown off my spinfusor aim :/)
If that's not possible on a hit scan weapon, maybe make it projectile-based with a very very high speed, then it can have as big a bullet as necessary. (plus it'll look cool

)

Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:48 am

Alpherior

Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm
Posts: 266
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

DibbzTheLoner wrote:

Alpherior wrote:

)

Yeah, you're probably right. Why make it more automatic/rapid fire when its supposed to be a 6shooter? I'd probably rather a bigger hitbox/more damage more anyways.

P.S. ... I'm the OP.

_________________

Main Class: Brute
(Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)

Wed Apr 04, 2012 3:28 pm

111uminate

Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 7:10 am
Posts: 387
Steam Gamer Name: WhiteCrow

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

Agreed. Brute definitely needs some new toys and we'll get them eventually, but I don't know how open they are to the idea of tweaking his current kit options. I really would love to see the HSF receive at least one more change for the better.

_________________

IGN: WhiteCrow (Yeah, I'm that guy.)

HiRezTodd wrote:

Data-porn!

Wed Apr 04, 2012 3:37 pm

Alpherior

Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm
Posts: 266
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

111uminate wrote:

I seriously hope the next patch or close to next patch is Brute-specific.

_________________

Main Class: Brute
(Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)

Wed Apr 04, 2012 8:46 pm

DibbzTheLoner

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:30 am
Posts: 1616
Location: Australia
Steam Gamer Name: Dibbz

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

Alpherior wrote:

P.S. ... I'm the OP.

.....dammit >.<

Set a profile picture or something man, trying to recognise people by name alone on forums is very difficult :/

Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:12 pm

Alpherior

Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm
Posts: 266
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

DibbzTheLoner wrote:

Alpherior wrote:

P.S. ... I'm the OP.

.....dammit >.<

Set a profile picture or something man, trying to recognize people by name alone on forums is very difficult :/

How has this not occured to me yet... Setting one now.

_________________

Main Class: Brute
(Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)

Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:15 pm

Alpherior

Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:01 pm
Posts: 266
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?

... Got my wicked picture now. Now I can push for Brute buffs with a visual identity.

_________________

Main Class: Brute
(Devestator Spinfusor/Plasma Cannon/Extended Fractal/Safety Third/Potential Energy/Survival Pack)

Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:33 pm

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ALL of Brute Weapons In Need of Adjustment?