Tribes:Ascend Forums

FAQ • Login • Register

Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil
Author	Message
ebonyknife Joined: Sun May 13, 2012 6:17 am Posts: 519	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil Fingon wrote: raqyee wrote: Immie wrote: Recoil is better suited for games where it only takes 1-2 bullets to kill something. In tribes, you need to huge a relatively huge number of bullets to kill something, and tracing a moving target for that long is usually quite difficult. Recoil would just make the whole process ridiculous and impossible for anyone but the very best players. Not to mention it would make game more random. And randomness is something that should be avoided in this kind of game. Not really, If you have a constant vertical recoil while shooting you could adjust for it. vertical recoil is different from what hes suggesting though. also there's not really much of a good reason to add recoil anyway. It just makes autos even harder to use for noobs (and they are already far harder to use than explosives), while good players would adjust pretty quickly, especially at shorter ranges, and you guys would start complaining again. _________________ Autos are fine, stop bitchin
Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:31 pm

Daekesh Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:46 am Posts: 3203	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil Heat > Recoil. Heat reduces rate of fire. Lessened by moving fast (so it doesn't effect chasing.) Only affects people standing around duelling. Get rid of fall-off damage (it's no longer needed.) Autos are now a lot better. _________________ TTaM, Lumberjack EU Admin and Lead (only?) Coder @ www.GameShrine.org. Tribes: Ascend competition for Europe, Oceania and the US.
Wed Jun 13, 2012 7:22 pm

SxxyKate Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 3:23 am Posts: 1614 Location: California	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil if you want CS recoil, then the bullets must be hitscan u can't have both _________________ SexyKate's Youtube Channel Clicky! Dueling Theory 101 : a beginner's guide to dueling in T:A
Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:06 pm

Lunia Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2011 7:27 pm Posts: 754	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil Cyrre wrote: I like the idea because recoil makes a shooter feel far, far, far more realistic. Somehow something is somewhat telling me that Tribes isn't trying to be realistic, it might be the plasma disc shooting guns, starships, cyborgs, jetpacks, aliens and the fact that the game is playing in like the year 2800 - 3900. Not to forget that I'm pretty sure if we ever make it to that year without blowing ourselves up we'll have guns with no recoil anyway. Especially when we're in some freaking robotic combat suit. But yeah, recoil isn't fitting with this game at all. Both gameplay and probably lore wise as well it ain't. Unless you make the guns hitscan, then it could maybe work, but hitscan seems way worse to me.
Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:24 pm

Cyrre Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 12:53 pm Posts: 2047	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil Kiss wrote: I'm pretty sure if we ever make it to that year without blowing ourselves up we'll have guns with no recoil anyway. Fact: gun recoil has increased thru history. You're thinking of lasers. _________________ I can only be successfully trolled by my spiritual or genetic counterpart. Sorry.
Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:39 pm

hvcterr Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:41 am Posts: 1567	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil I'd much rather have a gradual increase in spread than upwards recoil. It does the job It doesn't make the weapon harder to balance at different skill levels, since it impacts everyone equally. It doesn't give a possible advantage to people running scripts/macros. Yes, I know some people have a sort of abstract philosophical objection to "randomness", but that's over-simplistic and all guns already have a small cone-of-fire anyway. Cyrre wrote: Fact: gun recoil has increased thru history. You're thinking of lasers. Only in Hollywood. The increasing recoil, not the lasers, not unless you're talking about projectiles with fundamentally different momentums, like comparing early pistols to current howitzers. SxxyKate wrote: if you want CS recoil, then the bullets must be hitscan u can't have both I disagree. Care to explain why you think they're mutually-exclusive? _________________ Did you know you can disable annoying signatures? Look under Board Preferences >> Edit Display Options.
Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:40 pm

Saeviomage Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:59 pm Posts: 496	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil How about this: instead of nerfing SMGs, pay attention to the usage stats and tell the whingers to shut up. I've no problems with changing things, but the changes have to identify a genuine problem and then fix it. Currently the problem seems to be "people who don't use automatics whinge about getting killed by noobs with automatics" while the numbers show that noobs with automatics are really, really ineffective, and that noobs tend to avoid using automatics as much as they can. There's a possible interpretation of the starting problem statement using those facts that I will leave as an exercise to the reader.
Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:11 pm

illerFFN Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:52 pm Posts: 1174	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil I'm still spamming this Falcon piece of s*** and I honestly can't see any difference from last week. If anything I'm killing people twice as often just b/c they're letting their guard down now. The current nerfs should stay and Spread added on top.
Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:39 pm

LHeureux Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:35 pm Posts: 349	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil hvcterr wrote: SxxyKate wrote: if you want CS recoil, then the bullets must be hitscan u can't have both I disagree. Care to explain why you think they're mutually-exclusive? I think SxxyKate never played BF games, Planetside, etc. Just another troll post to show his "PLEASE DON'T NERF MY AUTOS, the only way I'm good in T:A cause I can't predict s***" _________________ I give up too.
Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:24 am

peacedudes12 Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:11 am Posts: 123	Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil T1/T2 had cones of fire on the CG It's probably still the best method of making sure autos aren't OP. _________________ Physics Fixes wtf is 72cap -Directional Jets Speed gain thru JETS not SKI - Proper CTF Scoring - True Inheritance - Cosine Splash - Active Regen - Performance Optimizations All me: pd12 \| ConfusedTodler - T1 \| PDConfusdTodla - T:A
Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:36 am

Display posts from previous: Sort by

Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

Author

Message

ebonyknife

Joined: Sun May 13, 2012 6:17 am
Posts: 519

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

Fingon wrote:

raqyee wrote:

Immie wrote:

Recoil is better suited for games where it only takes 1-2 bullets to kill something. In tribes, you need to huge a relatively huge number of bullets to kill something, and tracing a moving target for that long is usually quite difficult. Recoil would just make the whole process ridiculous and impossible for anyone but the very best players.

Not to mention it would make game more random. And randomness is something that should be avoided in this kind of game.

Not really, If you have a constant vertical recoil while shooting you could adjust for it.

vertical recoil is different from what hes suggesting though.

also there's not really much of a good reason to add recoil anyway. It just makes autos even harder to use for noobs (and they are already far harder to use than explosives), while good players would adjust pretty quickly, especially at shorter ranges, and you guys would start complaining again.

_________________
Autos are fine, stop bitchin

Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:31 pm

Daekesh

Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:46 am
Posts: 3203

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

Heat > Recoil. Heat reduces rate of fire. Lessened by moving fast (so it doesn't effect chasing.) Only affects people standing around duelling. Get rid of fall-off damage (it's no longer needed.) Autos are now a lot better.

_________________
TTaM, Lumberjack
EU Admin and Lead (only?) Coder @ www.GameShrine.org.
Tribes: Ascend competition for Europe, Oceania and the US.

Wed Jun 13, 2012 7:22 pm

SxxyKate

Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 3:23 am
Posts: 1614
Location: California

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

if you want CS recoil, then the bullets must be hitscan

u can't have both

_________________

SexyKate's Youtube Channel Clicky!
Dueling Theory 101 : a beginner's guide to dueling in T:A

Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:06 pm

Lunia

Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2011 7:27 pm
Posts: 754

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

Cyrre wrote:

I like the idea because recoil makes a shooter feel far, far, far more realistic.

Somehow something is somewhat telling me that Tribes isn't trying to be realistic, it might be the plasma disc shooting guns, starships, cyborgs, jetpacks, aliens and the fact that the game is playing in like the year 2800 - 3900. Not to forget that I'm pretty sure if we ever make it to that year without blowing ourselves up we'll have guns with no recoil anyway. Especially when we're in some freaking robotic combat suit.

But yeah, recoil isn't fitting with this game at all. Both gameplay and probably lore wise as well it ain't. Unless you make the guns hitscan, then it could maybe work, but hitscan seems way worse to me.

Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:24 pm

Cyrre

Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 12:53 pm
Posts: 2047

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

Kiss wrote:

I'm pretty sure if we ever make it to that year without blowing ourselves up we'll have guns with no recoil anyway.

Fact: gun recoil has increased thru history. You're thinking of lasers.

_________________
I can only be successfully trolled by my spiritual or genetic counterpart.
Sorry.

Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:39 pm

hvcterr

Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:41 am
Posts: 1567

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

I'd much rather have a gradual increase in spread than upwards recoil.

It does the job
It doesn't make the weapon harder to balance at different skill levels, since it impacts everyone equally.
It doesn't give a possible advantage to people running scripts/macros.

Yes, I know some people have a sort of abstract philosophical objection to "randomness", but that's over-simplistic and all guns already have a small cone-of-fire anyway.

Cyrre wrote:

Fact: gun recoil has increased thru history. You're thinking of lasers.

Only in Hollywood. The increasing recoil, not the lasers, not unless you're talking about projectiles with fundamentally different momentums, like comparing early pistols to current howitzers.

SxxyKate wrote:

if you want CS recoil, then the bullets must be hitscan
u can't have both

I disagree. Care to explain why you think they're mutually-exclusive?

_________________
Did you know you can disable annoying signatures? Look under Board Preferences >> Edit Display Options.

Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:40 pm

Saeviomage

Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:59 pm
Posts: 496

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

How about this:

instead of nerfing SMGs, pay attention to the usage stats and tell the whingers to shut up.

I've no problems with changing things, but the changes have to identify a genuine problem and then fix it. Currently the problem seems to be "people who don't use automatics whinge about getting killed by noobs with automatics" while the numbers show that noobs with automatics are really, really ineffective, and that noobs tend to avoid using automatics as much as they can.

There's a possible interpretation of the starting problem statement using those facts that I will leave as an exercise to the reader.

Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:11 pm

illerFFN

Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:52 pm
Posts: 1174

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

I'm still spamming this Falcon piece of s*** and I honestly can't see any difference from last week.
If anything I'm killing people twice as often just b/c they're letting their guard down now.

The current nerfs should stay and Spread added on top.

Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:39 pm

LHeureux

Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:35 pm
Posts: 349

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

hvcterr wrote:

SxxyKate wrote:

if you want CS recoil, then the bullets must be hitscan
u can't have both

I disagree. Care to explain why you think they're mutually-exclusive?

I think SxxyKate never played BF games, Planetside, etc. Just another troll post to show his "PLEASE DON'T NERF MY AUTOS, the only way I'm good in T:A cause I can't predict s***"

_________________
I give up too.

Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:24 am

peacedudes12

Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:11 am
Posts: 123

Re: Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil

T1/T2 had cones of fire on the CG

It's probably still the best method of making sure autos aren't OP.

_________________
Physics Fixes wtf is 72cap -Directional Jets Speed gain thru JETS not SKI - Proper CTF Scoring -
True Inheritance - Cosine Splash - Active Regen - Performance Optimizations

All me:
pd12 | ConfusedTodler - T1 | PDConfusdTodla - T:A

Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:36 am

Forum rules

Instead of balance/nerf SMG/AR why not just add recoil