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Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.
Author	Message
Melchi32 Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 11:46 pm Posts: 133	Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed. FreaK367 wrote: Removing the score screen while joining will do almost nothing, yes new players joining a server will have to randomly choose, but as soon as one team starts stacking, they often join the same team on the next map, and the next map... so people just join their team to reinforce the stacking, because they know they are going to win. I rarely see BS stacked, then DS, then BS, then DS etc.., if a server is stacked it will be Blood Eagle, Blood Eagle, Blood Eagle, Blood Eagle etc... winning (or Diamond Sword). Because the people stacking are all joining the same team, just mashing that team at the start to make sure they get in, just by looking at the amount of players per team at the start can show you which team is stacking, because the stacked team will always have 1 more player than the unstacked team, and the split second the teams are even, the stacked team is 1 player up, because people are spam clicking that team to stack. You agreed that it would reduce at least one kind of teamstacking. Yet, if everyone knows BE is winning because of 2-3 goldies, those goldies will see next match BE stacked and will be likely forced to go DS (low chances for 3 ppl on 32 to join the stacked team) and thus create pseudo-random teams. Freak367 wrote: And if people REALLY want to stack, they can just hit spectate for a few seconds and get all of the information they need to determine the stacked team, then join it. Then make joining a team/spectator definitive for the current match. Freak367 wrote: Without randomly assigning people, which nobody wants... stacking can't be prevented, but with a system in place like the one mentioned in my last post, it could be automatically moderated, and stackers could be split up/switched or simply warned. Your suggestion will take weeks to code, simply removing a score screen could take only a few minutes. Freak367 wrote: One other option, would to make winning pointless, remove all bonuses to winning, make rewards exact between the winning team and losing, based on performance. Then it doesn't really matter if you win, then hopefully people would be more willing to join the weaker team for a challenge. That still wouldn't prevent it though. That's a rather good idea. Make rewards based on "performance" instead of win or loss + rank. But that's kind of another debate. _________________ Base XP = time played BonusXP = [25%Base XP/rank] + [badges] + [25%Base XP if win] Thus XP is only based on : 1.time played in the match 2.team choosed 3.position achieved in the team Kills/accolades/credits/score mean nothing. Found on the wikia and checked on many scorescreens.
Sun May 27, 2012 9:36 pm

-AEnubis- Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:40 am Posts: 5052 Location: NA East	Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed. lol, yes lets just put up fences and signs, and create laws, instead of changing the fundamental system flaws. This is why the economy in the western world is falling apart. We need architects, not sheep leading sheep. _________________ Physics \| CTF Scoring \| Team Selection
Sun May 27, 2012 9:51 pm

Pingles Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:28 pm Posts: 1733	Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed. That's some serious out-of-the-blue rage there. _________________
Sun May 27, 2012 11:46 pm

-AEnubis- Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:40 am Posts: 5052 Location: NA East	Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed. I'm in the matrix, and I'm the only one who can see the code. They don't even know the why behind what they are arguing about. It's pointless conjecture. _________________ Physics \| CTF Scoring \| Team Selection
Mon May 28, 2012 12:56 am

Melchi32 Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 11:46 pm Posts: 133	Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed. -AEnubis- wrote: lol, yes lets just put up fences and signs, and create laws, instead of changing the fundamental system flaws. This is why the economy in the western world is falling apart. We need architects, not sheep leading sheep. Terry Pratchett wrote: "Only a mile away from the shepherd and his flock was a goatherd and his herd. The merest accident of microgeography had meant that the first man to hear the voice of [God], and who gave [God] his view of humans, was a shepherd and not a goatherd. They have quite different ways of looking at the world, and the whole of history might have been different. For sheep are stupid, and have to be driven. But goats are intelligent, and need to be led." _________________ Base XP = time played BonusXP = [25%Base XP/rank] + [badges] + [25%Base XP if win] Thus XP is only based on : 1.time played in the match 2.team choosed 3.position achieved in the team Kills/accolades/credits/score mean nothing. Found on the wikia and checked on many scorescreens.
Mon May 28, 2012 9:28 am

AcidMantis Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:25 pm Posts: 179	Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed. Goats are only marginally smarter than sheep. If you hold your foot out in the air front of you for a few minutes, a goat will suddenly think it is the head of another goat putting its head down and challenging it, and begin piledriving it with his head.
Mon May 28, 2012 9:35 am

rascallion Joined: Sun May 27, 2012 4:45 pm Posts: 2	Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed. Hello, Just a few more thoughts on the topic. I have seen a number of times when one team has up to 2 more players than the other, and this is usually significant in the battle. Perhaps it would help to only allow the losing team to be joined when the number of players are equal or deficit for the losing team. It's not a complete fix, but maybe it would also help create more of those tight games we all love, even when there isn't any stacking occurring. One more idea. Give us the option to join a match where the teams are completely random with auto-balancing the only way to switch sides (spectators would forfeit ability to join the match, of course). Friends and clans could still use the original queue to play together, and those of us that are in despair over stacking could go on to enjoy the game again. I must admit, I haven't been to these forums before, but I came here looking specifically for a post on the stacking problem. I was getting crushed for half of a day before I could get my first win of the day bonus in CTF. A lot of that must have been bad luck, but the teamstacking surely didn't help. It was bad enough that I could see something was seriously out of whack, but I was relieved to find that people here have identified the causes and are already seeking a solution to the problem. I'm really looking forward to some positive changes. Thanks for your time.
Mon May 28, 2012 11:51 am

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Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.

Author

Message

Melchi32

Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 11:46 pm
Posts: 133

Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.

FreaK367 wrote:

Removing the score screen while joining will do almost nothing, yes new players joining a server will have to randomly choose, but as soon as one team starts stacking, they often join the same team on the next map, and the next map... so people just join their team to reinforce the stacking, because they know they are going to win.

I rarely see BS stacked, then DS, then BS, then DS etc.., if a server is stacked it will be Blood Eagle, Blood Eagle, Blood Eagle, Blood Eagle etc... winning (or Diamond Sword). Because the people stacking are all joining the same team, just mashing that team at the start to make sure they get in, just by looking at the amount of players per team at the start can show you which team is stacking, because the stacked team will always have 1 more player than the unstacked team, and the split second the teams are even, the stacked team is 1 player up, because people are spam clicking that team to stack.

You agreed that it would reduce at least one kind of teamstacking.
Yet, if everyone knows BE is winning because of 2-3 goldies, those goldies will see next match BE stacked and will be likely forced to go DS (low chances for 3 ppl on 32 to join the stacked team) and thus create pseudo-random teams.

Freak367 wrote:

And if people REALLY want to stack, they can just hit spectate for a few seconds and get all of the information they need to determine the stacked team, then join it.

Then make joining a team/spectator definitive for the current match.

Freak367 wrote:

Without randomly assigning people, which nobody wants... stacking can't be prevented, but with a system in place like the one mentioned in my last post, it could be automatically moderated, and stackers could be split up/switched or simply warned.

Your suggestion will take weeks to code, simply removing a score screen could take only a few minutes.

Freak367 wrote:

One other option, would to make winning pointless, remove all bonuses to winning, make rewards exact between the winning team and losing, based on performance. Then it doesn't really matter if you win, then hopefully people would be more willing to join the weaker team for a challenge. That still wouldn't prevent it though.

That's a rather good idea. Make rewards based on "performance" instead of win or loss + rank. But that's kind of another debate.

_________________
Base XP = time played
BonusXP = [25%Base XP/rank] + [badges] + [25%Base XP if win]
Thus XP is only based on :
1.time played in the match
2.team choosed
3.position achieved in the team
Kills/accolades/credits/score mean nothing.
Found on the wikia and checked on many scorescreens.

Sun May 27, 2012 9:36 pm

-AEnubis-

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:40 am
Posts: 5052
Location: NA East

Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.

lol, yes lets just put up fences and signs, and create laws, instead of changing the fundamental system flaws.

This is why the economy in the western world is falling apart. We need architects, not sheep leading sheep.

_________________

Physics | CTF Scoring | Team Selection

Sun May 27, 2012 9:51 pm

Pingles

Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:28 pm
Posts: 1733

Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.

That's some serious out-of-the-blue rage there.

_________________

Sun May 27, 2012 11:46 pm

-AEnubis-

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:40 am
Posts: 5052
Location: NA East

Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.

I'm in the matrix, and I'm the only one who can see the code. They don't even know the why behind what they are arguing about. It's pointless conjecture.

_________________

Physics | CTF Scoring | Team Selection

Mon May 28, 2012 12:56 am

Melchi32

Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 11:46 pm
Posts: 133

Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.

-AEnubis- wrote:

Terry Pratchett wrote:

"Only a mile away from the shepherd and his flock was a goatherd and his herd. The merest accident of microgeography had meant that the first man to hear the voice of [God], and who gave [God] his view of humans, was a shepherd and not a goatherd. They have quite different ways of looking at the world, and the whole of history might have been different.

For sheep are stupid, and have to be driven. But goats are intelligent, and need to be led."

Mon May 28, 2012 9:28 am

AcidMantis

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:25 pm
Posts: 179

Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.

Goats are only marginally smarter than sheep. If you hold your foot out in the air front of you for a few minutes, a goat will suddenly think it is the head of another goat putting its head down and challenging it, and begin piledriving it with his head.

Mon May 28, 2012 9:35 am

rascallion

Joined: Sun May 27, 2012 4:45 pm
Posts: 2

Re: Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.

Hello,

Just a few more thoughts on the topic. I have seen a number of times when one team has up to 2 more players than the other, and this is usually significant in the battle. Perhaps it would help to only allow the losing team to be joined when the number of players are equal or deficit for the losing team. It's not a complete fix, but maybe it would also help create more of those tight games we all love, even when there isn't any stacking occurring.

One more idea. Give us the option to join a match where the teams are completely random with auto-balancing the only way to switch sides (spectators would forfeit ability to join the match, of course). Friends and clans could still use the original queue to play together, and those of us that are in despair over stacking could go on to enjoy the game again.

I must admit, I haven't been to these forums before, but I came here looking specifically for a post on the stacking problem. I was getting crushed for half of a day before I could get my first win of the day bonus in CTF. A lot of that must have been bad luck, but the teamstacking surely didn't help. It was bad enough that I could see something was seriously out of whack, but I was relieved to find that people here have identified the causes and are already seeking a solution to the problem. I'm really looking forward to some positive changes.

Thanks for your time.

Mon May 28, 2012 11:51 am

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Teamstacking really, really needs to be fixed.