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Some CTF map feedback with pictures.
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Coloradoguy234 Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:26 pm Posts: 178 Location: Colorado	Some CTF map feedback with pictures. I've noticed a few things with some of the CTF maps that either would create more functionality for placements and defense. I've tried to make my suggestions as clear as possible. Thanks in advance for reading. ARX Novena. I don't have many problems with this map. My biggest problem is that its too easy to get into the gen room, because of a small hill the main entrance isn't covered by a turret. Here is another image of the hill. Crossfire I have 2 complaints and suggestions about this map 1) This map makes it too easy to use Orb Strikes and Tact Strikes. In fact you can do it from the safety of your gen room. The following pic is from a top my base. 2) Turret placement seems weak and kinda pointless. Frontal turret is guarding the ground and not the flag and the rear turret doesn't guard the rear entrance. The following shows where I would suggest moving them. Katabatic I am really bothered by this map. The only thing this map brings over from Tribes 2 is the snow. Here are my complaints. 1) The cave into the DS generator is better protected than the BE cave. Notice the DS base has turret coverage and a blind corner into the gen room. 2) Here is the BE cave. Notice I can stand there and not be shot at by the turret. Also notice its a straight shot into the gen room. 3) The 2nd turret isn't in a good position for defense and isn't faithful to the original. Here is my suggest of where to move it to make it a viable defense and more faithful to the original. Flatten the roof, move the turret to the edge and remove the bridge. 4) The flag should be moved to the original place. Namely here. Again flatten the roof, move the radar dish and rear turret, and put the flag between the 2 buildings. Sunstar I have a few core complaints against this map. Mostly it is too easy to get into the gen room, you're vastly crippled by your gens going down, the gen room is something out of the Benny Hill Show and the 2nd turret is worthless. 1) This shows that the turret doesn't defend anything and the 2nd pic is where I would move it. 2) This is why the gen room is something from Benny Hill. Simply put it is too big and has too many paths. Its so common to see people chasing Raiders and Infils from 1 passage to the other. I suggest removing the 3rd branching passage or place a wall as shown. Temple Ruins I only have 3 complaints here. The gen room is too big (again) to defend with standard mines and turrets, the turrets could using moving and there is something really cool that should take center stage. 1) Simply put the gen room is too big for turrets and mines to work. Deployables on the bottom floor can be avoided by people on the top floor and the upper floor is so big turrets don't have effective reach to both entrances and can be avoided by walls. 2) The turrets could use moving. Turret 1 just needs moved forward and raised to cover the flag and gen entrance. Turret 2 needs to be moved closer to the 2nd gen entrance. 3) This needs to play a bigger part in the map. It is so detailed that shoving it in the back where no one will notice seems like a waste. Last edited by Coloradoguy234 on Fri May 04, 2012 10:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Fri May 04, 2012 7:11 pm

Frostiken Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am Posts: 1045	Re: Some CTF maps suggestions with pictures. VGCA I think calling Katabatic Katabatic is almost an insult. I don't think moving the flag into the crack between the buildings would be the best solution, but at the very least it needs to be moved underneath the little building. The Katabatic flag is nearly impossible to properly defend. There's easy routes in all directions and it can be grabbed from anywhere. Whoever thought that up needs to be slapped. The only suggestions I'd be willing to field for Katabatic is to make it a 1:1 recreation of the T2 map. Nothing less will do in my eyes. The original map was fine and would work just fine in T:A too. The generator was nestled deep in the base which already had multiple ingress points, albeit much better defended. The flag was open, but somewhat entrenched and defensible. The only annoying thing about the T2 map were the overlarge 'outpost' bases which were sort of superfluous.
Fri May 04, 2012 8:37 pm

LHeureux Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:35 pm Posts: 349	Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures. All good points. Also sorry to say it but for Katabatic and Arx Novena : Since Hi-Rez said those maps were in their "final" state. The only thing that can be changed them is to fix bugs. _________________ I give up too.
Fri May 04, 2012 11:04 pm

Coloradoguy234 Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:26 pm Posts: 178 Location: Colorado	Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures. LHeureux wrote: All good points. Also sorry to say it but for Katabatic and Arx Novena : Since Hi-Rez said those maps were in their "final" state. The only thing that can be changed them is to fix bugs. lol not surprising but doesn't mean no one should speak up. Only a foolish developer would ignore its customers.
Fri May 04, 2012 11:38 pm

Frostiken Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am Posts: 1045	Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures. Coloradoguy234 wrote: LHeureux wrote: All good points. Also sorry to say it but for Katabatic and Arx Novena : Since Hi-Rez said those maps were in their "final" state. The only thing that can be changed them is to fix bugs. lol not surprising but doesn't mean no one should speak up. Only a foolish developer would ignore its customers. Clearly you overestimate Hi-Rez. Let me introduce you to the 100+ page ballistic weapon feedback threads.
Fri May 04, 2012 11:57 pm

starlinvf Beta Tester Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:31 am Posts: 1478	Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures. Frostiken wrote: Coloradoguy234 wrote: LHeureux wrote: All good points. Also sorry to say it but for Katabatic and Arx Novena : Since Hi-Rez said those maps were in their "final" state. The only thing that can be changed them is to fix bugs. lol not surprising but doesn't mean no one should speak up. Only a foolish developer would ignore its customers. Clearly you overestimate Hi-Rez. Let me introduce you to the 100+ page ballistic weapon feedback threads. And the 2 physics threads every week during beta. _________________ "Even if it is just a gimmick, you can bet it'll be a crowd pleaser to see a player's feet kick up in the air and initiate a top down attack."
Sat May 05, 2012 12:40 am

Frostiken Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am Posts: 1045	Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures. And the constant Brute / Saber threads.
Sat May 05, 2012 12:56 am

Coloradoguy234 Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:26 pm Posts: 178 Location: Colorado	Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures. Frostiken wrote: And the constant Brute / Saber threads. From what I understand that is coming with the next release.
Sat May 05, 2012 1:47 am

NotSoCoolJ Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2012 10:18 pm Posts: 134	Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures. OK so the turret placements are bugs then. I totally agree with everything. Maybe not totally on the Katabatic flag thing. I do think it needs to be moved back to under the cover though. Any stand design that makes playing HOF impossible is just bad design. It will make the pathfinders have to tighten up their approach a little bit. Not enough to be an issue if Temple is any indicator. It will just stop the free reign strike clear and non-stop mortar spam. Jugs will still be able to mortar it. They will just have to use a little more finesse. I will also attest to the fact that an orbital will still murder you under there. Seriously, Hirez, Do these things. Just about everyone playing, that has a firm grasp on the game mode, will agree. I love playing Path and Jug and I agree. Turret placement is kinda dumb if it isn't covering anything. I play path enough to know that I can normally avoid them. In fact, LVL1 turrets are the only ones that really ever give me trouble. If I see they have been upgraded I just fly by. _________________
Sat May 05, 2012 2:27 am

Coloradoguy234 Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:26 pm Posts: 178 Location: Colorado	Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures. Glad to see people agree with most of my ideas . I'm a cynic so I doubt Hi-Rez will listen to 1 thread but hopefully it gives them ideas on future maps. Also all these problem would be fixed if they released the map editor. If They did that I would fix all the maps myself lol. Plus I have a great map I was never able to release for T:V.
Sat May 05, 2012 4:22 pm

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Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

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Coloradoguy234

Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:26 pm
Posts: 178
Location: Colorado

Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

I've noticed a few things with some of the CTF maps that either would create more functionality for placements and defense. I've tried to make my suggestions as clear as possible. Thanks in advance for reading.

ARX Novena.
I don't have many problems with this map. My biggest problem is that its too easy to get into the gen room, because of a small hill the main entrance isn't covered by a turret.

Here is another image of the hill.

Crossfire
I have 2 complaints and suggestions about this map

1) This map makes it too easy to use Orb Strikes and Tact Strikes. In fact you can do it from the safety of your gen room. The following pic is from a top my base.

2) Turret placement seems weak and kinda pointless. Frontal turret is guarding the ground and not the flag and the rear turret doesn't guard the rear entrance. The following shows where I would suggest moving them.

Katabatic
I am really bothered by this map. The only thing this map brings over from Tribes 2 is the snow. Here are my complaints.

1) The cave into the DS generator is better protected than the BE cave. Notice the DS base has turret coverage and a blind corner into the gen room.

2) Here is the BE cave. Notice I can stand there and not be shot at by the turret. Also notice its a straight shot into the gen room.

3) The 2nd turret isn't in a good position for defense and isn't faithful to the original. Here is my suggest of where to move it to make it a viable defense and more faithful to the original. Flatten the roof, move the turret to the edge and remove the bridge.

4) The flag should be moved to the original place. Namely here. Again flatten the roof, move the radar dish and rear turret, and put the flag between the 2 buildings.

Sunstar
I have a few core complaints against this map. Mostly it is too easy to get into the gen room, you're vastly crippled by your gens going down, the gen room is something out of the Benny Hill Show and the 2nd turret is worthless.

1) This shows that the turret doesn't defend anything and the 2nd pic is where I would move it.

2) This is why the gen room is something from Benny Hill. Simply put it is too big and has too many paths. Its so common to see people chasing Raiders and Infils from 1 passage to the other. I suggest removing the 3rd branching passage or place a wall as shown.

Temple Ruins
I only have 3 complaints here. The gen room is too big (again) to defend with standard mines and turrets, the turrets could using moving and there is something really cool that should take center stage.

1) Simply put the gen room is too big for turrets and mines to work. Deployables on the bottom floor can be avoided by people on the top floor and the upper floor is so big turrets don't have effective reach to both entrances and can be avoided by walls.

2) The turrets could use moving. Turret 1 just needs moved forward and raised to cover the flag and gen entrance. Turret 2 needs to be moved closer to the 2nd gen entrance.

3) This needs to play a bigger part in the map. It is so detailed that shoving it in the back where no one will notice seems like a waste.

Last edited by Coloradoguy234 on Fri May 04, 2012 10:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Fri May 04, 2012 7:11 pm

Frostiken

Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am
Posts: 1045

Re: Some CTF maps suggestions with pictures.

VGCA

I think calling Katabatic Katabatic is almost an insult. I don't think moving the flag into the crack between the buildings would be the best solution, but at the very least it needs to be moved underneath the little building. The Katabatic flag is nearly impossible to properly defend. There's easy routes in all directions and it can be grabbed from anywhere. Whoever thought that up needs to be slapped.

The only suggestions I'd be willing to field for Katabatic is to make it a 1:1 recreation of the T2 map. Nothing less will do in my eyes. The original map was fine and would work just fine in T:A too. The generator was nestled deep in the base which already had multiple ingress points, albeit much better defended. The flag was open, but somewhat entrenched and defensible. The only annoying thing about the T2 map were the overlarge 'outpost' bases which were sort of superfluous.

Fri May 04, 2012 8:37 pm

LHeureux

Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:35 pm
Posts: 349

Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

All good points.

Also sorry to say it but for Katabatic and Arx Novena :

Since Hi-Rez said those maps were in their "final" state. The only thing that can be changed them is to fix bugs.

_________________
I give up too.

Fri May 04, 2012 11:04 pm

Coloradoguy234

Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:26 pm
Posts: 178
Location: Colorado

Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

LHeureux wrote:

All good points.

Also sorry to say it but for Katabatic and Arx Novena :

Since Hi-Rez said those maps were in their "final" state. The only thing that can be changed them is to fix bugs.

lol not surprising but doesn't mean no one should speak up. Only a foolish developer would ignore its customers.

Fri May 04, 2012 11:38 pm

Frostiken

Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am
Posts: 1045

Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

Coloradoguy234 wrote:

LHeureux wrote:

All good points.

Also sorry to say it but for Katabatic and Arx Novena :

Since Hi-Rez said those maps were in their "final" state. The only thing that can be changed them is to fix bugs.

lol not surprising but doesn't mean no one should speak up. Only a foolish developer would ignore its customers.

Clearly you overestimate Hi-Rez. Let me introduce you to the 100+ page ballistic weapon feedback threads.

Fri May 04, 2012 11:57 pm

starlinvf

Beta Tester

Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 6:31 am
Posts: 1478

Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

Frostiken wrote:

Coloradoguy234 wrote:

LHeureux wrote:

All good points.

Also sorry to say it but for Katabatic and Arx Novena :

Since Hi-Rez said those maps were in their "final" state. The only thing that can be changed them is to fix bugs.

lol not surprising but doesn't mean no one should speak up. Only a foolish developer would ignore its customers.

Clearly you overestimate Hi-Rez. Let me introduce you to the 100+ page ballistic weapon feedback threads.

And the 2 physics threads every week during beta.

_________________
"Even if it is just a gimmick, you can bet it'll be a crowd pleaser to see a player's feet kick up in the air and initiate a top down attack."

Sat May 05, 2012 12:40 am

Frostiken

Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am
Posts: 1045

Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

And the constant Brute / Saber threads.

Sat May 05, 2012 12:56 am

Coloradoguy234

Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:26 pm
Posts: 178
Location: Colorado

Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

Frostiken wrote:

And the constant Brute / Saber threads.

From what I understand that is coming with the next release.

Sat May 05, 2012 1:47 am

NotSoCoolJ

Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2012 10:18 pm
Posts: 134

Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

OK so the turret placements are bugs then. I totally agree with everything.

Maybe not totally on the Katabatic flag thing. I do think it needs to be moved back to under the cover though. Any stand design that makes playing HOF impossible is just bad design. It will make the pathfinders have to tighten up their approach a little bit. Not enough to be an issue if Temple is any indicator. It will just stop the free reign strike clear and non-stop mortar spam. Jugs will still be able to mortar it. They will just have to use a little more finesse. I will also attest to the fact that an orbital will still murder you under there. :oops:

Seriously, Hirez, Do these things.
Just about everyone playing, that has a firm grasp on the game mode, will agree. I love playing Path and Jug and I agree. Turret placement is kinda dumb if it isn't covering anything. I play path enough to know that I can normally avoid them. In fact, LVL1 turrets are the only ones that really ever give me trouble. If I see they have been upgraded I just fly by.

_________________

Sat May 05, 2012 2:27 am

Coloradoguy234

Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:26 pm
Posts: 178
Location: Colorado

Re: Some CTF map feedback with pictures.

Glad to see people agree with most of my ideas

. I'm a cynic so I doubt Hi-Rez will listen to 1 thread but hopefully it gives them ideas on future maps.

Also all these problem would be fixed if they released the map editor. If They did that I would fix all the maps myself lol. Plus I have a great map I was never able to release for T:V.

Sat May 05, 2012 4:22 pm

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Some CTF map feedback with pictures.