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Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...
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FvkuC Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2012 7:24 pm Posts: 7	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... I played my fastest game a couple weeks ago. It was crossfire with myself and another capper. the game lasted about 2:25 total (two minutes + some!). I wouldn't say I'm a pubstar PTH by any means but I knew that the best time to grab and cap was at the very beginning of the game and immediately after a cap. So we just took turns grabbing and capping and before we knew it the game ended. The problem wasn't the capping, it was the complete lack of D. I had two friends playing flag D on my side that ran to the flag to get defenses up the second the game started whereas the other team would try to play capture the gen on us. It's pub and until ranked games comes out the best you can do to avoid it is play custom servers with a rank requirement (5150 East!)
Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:22 pm

SFJake Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:11 pm Posts: 381	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... I feel the need to come back to this topic every day now. I'm really not having fun anymore. I'm sick to death of every little things that happens in CTF. The juggernauts that are never stopped until you do something about it. The spinfusor spam from accross half the map nobody can do anything about. Anytime someone gets the flag and gets away I start deathmatching and going to the gen, because who cares, right? You can't catch him. Play doombringer? Lol right, just get spammed from half a map away and they get the flag. Can't do nothing about it. Deal with those jugs? Lol right, during which the flag gets capped and is accross the map anyway. Whats the point? Nothing seems to have any POINT to it whatsoever. No matter what, someone will cap or not, and thats it. There isn't a d*** THING you can do about it. Even with a lot of defenses, its ridiculous how pathfinders can still get through, detonate a mine, go through a force field, who cares, they're still making it home. I quit more match than I play nowadays. 90% of the time, the other team gets a cap in less than a minute, and I leave. I already know its going to suck. _________________ http://sfjake.zxq.net Last edited by SFJake on Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:29 pm

Pingles Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:28 pm Posts: 1733	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... On NA West I've been very impressed lately. Yes, we get a few insta-matches but overall we get some good, long matches. _________________
Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:32 pm

WitchDoctorVega Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 1:15 am Posts: 2482 Location: On the coast, NH Steam Gamer Name: ..WitchDoctor..	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... C&H is significantly more fun at this point. do things right and you can defend a post almost by your self. _________________ CYBRIDS 4 LYF! Metagens 4 ever!
Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:34 pm

irimi Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:37 am Posts: 478	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... I wish I had more players like the one the OP is complaining about when I play CTF. Everybody (including the OP) doesn't actually seem to want to play CTF in CTF games anymore.
Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:10 pm

Frostiken Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am Posts: 1045	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... irimi wrote: I wish I had more players like the one the OP is complaining about when I play CTF. Everybody (including the OP) doesn't actually seem to want to play CTF in CTF games anymore. Maybe I want capturing the flag to be an accomplishment that required your team like it used to be, not something that 1/3rd of a server is dedicating themselves to doing.
Wed May 02, 2012 8:11 pm

caaok Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 11:55 pm Posts: 1110	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... How does a screenshot of 4/5 pathfinders per team in a 27 player match prove anything for your argument? They could be chasers, they could just be people deathmatching, some of them are newer players that might not have all of the classes unlocked, etc. I agree that capturing the flag used to be more difficult overall, for a plethora of reasons. But your QQ about cappers isn't solving anything. Heaven forbid people worry about the flag in capture the flag, I'm always stoked when I luck out and get a team that understands the importance of the flag and the relative unimportance of the generator. _________________ What we lose with hitscan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7XevsFIitY
Wed May 02, 2012 10:13 pm

Frostiken Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am Posts: 1045	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... caaok wrote: How does a screenshot of 4/5 pathfinders per team in a 27 player match prove anything for your argument? They could be chasers, they could just be people deathmatching, some of them are newer players that might not have all of the classes unlocked, etc. I agree that capturing the flag used to be more difficult overall, for a plethora of reasons. But your QQ about cappers isn't solving anything. Heaven forbid people worry about the flag in capture the flag, I'm always stoked when I luck out and get a team that understands the importance of the flag and the relative unimportance of the generator. Because they weren't chasers, they weren't deathmatching. It was literally a stream of them going for the flag over, and over, and over again. Notice I'm playing HOF. Do you have any idea what that's like? It was literally the dullest, s*** game of CTF I've ever played, and we lost it through sheer attrition. Six Pathfinders literally queuing up on the hillside to hit a grab over, and over, and over again are going to grab the flag and there's nothing you can really do. People caring about the flag is fine. People carrying so much about the flag that they commit themselves completely to it, in a game where capturing the flag isn't very hard and balance is heavily biased against defenders is not fine. That's what's making CTF games suck and, from what I see from various forum threads, is what's driving people away. You can make tons of points as defense in this game, but almost nobody defends, because defense in this game is underpowered, makes you feel impotent, and is an overall terrible gameplay experience. Flag cappers get excellent dueling weapons, get the fun of high-speed skiing at speeds mostly unattainable to others, oh get the 'privilege' of winning the match. People aren't going to play a class that does poorly. Fact. Even when Raider and Infiltrator got their updates, the classes were nowhere near this popular. Pathfinder is so popular, why do you think even though people can clearly see that there's already 5 of them on their team, they go ahead and decide to be number 6 and go for the flag as well, right behind the other guys that are in front of them? With 5 Pathfinders as well as the general offensive actions that are taken by the rest of the grunts on their team, it's quite obvious that 'attacking the flag' is already something their team is doing. So what would prompt someone to be Pathfinder number 6?
Thu May 03, 2012 9:24 am

caaok Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 11:55 pm Posts: 1110	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... I've been in that exact situation as a HoF. 5 paths queueing on a hill means they probably have little stand offense, are coming in at 150-200kph, and probably coming from the same direction each time. If you had 3-5 people on the flag, it'd have been a meat-grinder. If it was just you and no other defense, why should you win 5v1? _________________ What we lose with hitscan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7XevsFIitY
Thu May 03, 2012 9:31 am

ctrl-k Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 9:48 am Posts: 89	Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF... caaok wrote: I've been in that exact situation as a HoF. 5 paths queueing on a hill means they probably have little stand offense, are coming in at 150-200kph, and probably coming from the same direction each time. If you had 3-5 people on the flag, it'd have been a meat-grinder. If it was just you and no other defense, why should you win 5v1? This. If you're the only one defending the flag, it means your team sucks and it unfortunately can't really be helped. The prevalence of incompetent ctf players means that a small number of semi competent ones can turn games very onesided.
Thu May 03, 2012 9:49 am

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Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

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Message

FvkuC

Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2012 7:24 pm
Posts: 7

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

I played my fastest game a couple weeks ago. It was crossfire with myself and another capper. the game lasted about 2:25 total (two minutes + some!). I wouldn't say I'm a pubstar PTH by any means but I knew that the best time to grab and cap was at the very beginning of the game and immediately after a cap. So we just took turns grabbing and capping and before we knew it the game ended.

The problem wasn't the capping, it was the complete lack of D. I had two friends playing flag D on my side that ran to the flag to get defenses up the second the game started whereas the other team would try to play capture the gen on us. It's pub and until ranked games comes out the best you can do to avoid it is play custom servers with a rank requirement (5150 East!)

Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:22 pm

SFJake

Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 11:11 pm
Posts: 381

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

I feel the need to come back to this topic every day now.

I'm really not having fun anymore. I'm sick to death of every little things that happens in CTF. The juggernauts that are never stopped until you do something about it. The spinfusor spam from accross half the map nobody can do anything about. Anytime someone gets the flag and gets away I start deathmatching and going to the gen, because who cares, right? You can't catch him.

Play doombringer? Lol right, just get spammed from half a map away and they get the flag. Can't do nothing about it.

Deal with those jugs? Lol right, during which the flag gets capped and is accross the map anyway. Whats the point?

Nothing seems to have any POINT to it whatsoever. No matter what, someone will cap or not, and thats it. There isn't a d*** THING you can do about it. Even with a lot of defenses, its ridiculous how pathfinders can still get through, detonate a mine, go through a force field, who cares, they're still making it home.

I quit more match than I play nowadays. 90% of the time, the other team gets a cap in less than a minute, and I leave. I already know its going to suck.

_________________
http://sfjake.zxq.net

Last edited by SFJake on Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:29 pm

Pingles

Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:28 pm
Posts: 1733

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

On NA West I've been very impressed lately. Yes, we get a few insta-matches but overall we get some good, long matches.

_________________

Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:32 pm

WitchDoctorVega

Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 1:15 am
Posts: 2482
Location: On the coast, NH
Steam Gamer Name: ..WitchDoctor..

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

C&H is significantly more fun at this point. do things right and you can defend a post almost by your self.

_________________
CYBRIDS 4 LYF! Metagens 4 ever!

Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:34 pm

irimi

Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:37 am
Posts: 478

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

I wish I had more players like the one the OP is complaining about when I play CTF.

Everybody (including the OP) doesn't actually seem to want to play CTF in CTF games anymore.

Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:10 pm

Frostiken

Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am
Posts: 1045

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

irimi wrote:

I wish I had more players like the one the OP is complaining about when I play CTF.

Everybody (including the OP) doesn't actually seem to want to play CTF in CTF games anymore.

Maybe I want capturing the flag to be an accomplishment that required your team like it used to be, not something that 1/3rd of a server is dedicating themselves to doing.

Wed May 02, 2012 8:11 pm

caaok

Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 11:55 pm
Posts: 1110

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

How does a screenshot of 4/5 pathfinders per team in a 27 player match prove anything for your argument? They could be chasers, they could just be people deathmatching, some of them are newer players that might not have all of the classes unlocked, etc.

I agree that capturing the flag used to be more difficult overall, for a plethora of reasons. But your QQ about cappers isn't solving anything. Heaven forbid people worry about the flag in capture the flag, I'm always stoked when I luck out and get a team that understands the importance of the flag and the relative unimportance of the generator.

_________________
What we lose with hitscan:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7XevsFIitY

Wed May 02, 2012 10:13 pm

Frostiken

Joined: Sat Dec 25, 2010 12:42 am
Posts: 1045

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

caaok wrote:

Because they weren't chasers, they weren't deathmatching. It was literally a stream of them going for the flag over, and over, and over again. Notice I'm playing HOF. Do you have any idea what that's like? It was literally the dullest, s*** game of CTF I've ever played, and we lost it through sheer attrition. Six Pathfinders literally queuing up on the hillside to hit a grab over, and over, and over again are going to grab the flag and there's nothing you can really do.

People caring about the flag is fine. People carrying so much about the flag that they commit themselves completely to it, in a game where capturing the flag isn't very hard and balance is heavily biased against defenders is not fine. That's what's making CTF games suck and, from what I see from various forum threads, is what's driving people away.

You can make tons of points as defense in this game, but almost nobody defends, because defense in this game is underpowered, makes you feel impotent, and is an overall terrible gameplay experience. Flag cappers get excellent dueling weapons, get the fun of high-speed skiing at speeds mostly unattainable to others, oh get the 'privilege' of winning the match.

People aren't going to play a class that does poorly. Fact. Even when Raider and Infiltrator got their updates, the classes were nowhere near this popular. Pathfinder is so popular, why do you think even though people can clearly see that there's already 5 of them on their team, they go ahead and decide to be number 6 and go for the flag as well, right behind the other guys that are in front of them? With 5 Pathfinders as well as the general offensive actions that are taken by the rest of the grunts on their team, it's quite obvious that 'attacking the flag' is already something their team is doing.

So what would prompt someone to be Pathfinder number 6?

Thu May 03, 2012 9:24 am

caaok

Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 11:55 pm
Posts: 1110

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

I've been in that exact situation as a HoF. 5 paths queueing on a hill means they probably have little stand offense, are coming in at 150-200kph, and probably coming from the same direction each time. If you had 3-5 people on the flag, it'd have been a meat-grinder. If it was just you and no other defense, why should you win 5v1?

_________________
What we lose with hitscan:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7XevsFIitY

Thu May 03, 2012 9:31 am

ctrl-k

Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 9:48 am
Posts: 89

Re: Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...

caaok wrote:

This. If you're the only one defending the flag, it means your team sucks and it unfortunately can't really be helped. The prevalence of incompetent ctf players means that a small number of semi competent ones can turn games very onesided.

Thu May 03, 2012 9:49 am

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Starting to absolutely loathe CTF...