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Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1
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Anubins Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:35 am Posts: 43 Location: United Kingdom Steam Gamer Name: [BLUF]Syph	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 Honestly, I think HR is doing a pretty bang up job with patches recently. My internet admittedly isn't great so takes some time downloading the updates in the first place, but I had a large file to download last update, and this one is 6000MB, rounded. Sure, it's one thing to say that quality of content is better than size, but if you ask me? There's got to be at least something in here. Just one British bloke's opinion, but, hey. _________________ I'm Commander Shepard, and this is my favourite post on the extranet.
Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:30 pm

Sansa Beta Tester Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:37 pm Posts: 4237	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 Baharroth wrote: Finally, weapons on the AH, good to see. Sansa wrote: So basically it's the other PvP map added, but flair doesn't start until the 15th? Oh come on! Map first! Besides, let it get closer to Christmas... I'm not mad or anything, I just thought there was flair today but there wasn't. Logged in, found out no flair, logged out to do stuff, now gonna log back in lol. Edit: I should have said 'and' instead of 'but' so it didn't sound negative. Edit2: I realize the patch is more than those things. I'm sick today, critical thinking skills are nonexistent. Last edited by Sansa on Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:44 pm

HiRezKate Hi-Rez Team Member Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:00 pm Posts: 790 Location: Dome City	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 Sansa wrote: Baharroth wrote: Finally, weapons on the AH, good to see. Sansa wrote: So basically it's the other PvP map added, but flair doesn't start until the 15th? Oh come on! Map first! Besides, let it get closer to Christmas... I'm not mad or anything, I just thought there was flair today but there wasn't. Logged in, found out no flair, logged out to do stuff, now gonna log back in lol. Edit: I should have said 'and' instead of 'but' so it didn't sound negative. We'll let ya know when the Christmas stuff launches, Sansa =) _________________ MagiCandyBar wrote: Soon.™ blackchimes wrote: WORST MAP EVER, TOO SMALL/TOO BIG, THE HILLS ARE NOT HIGH ENOUGH/THE HILLS ARE TOO HIGH, THE FLAG IS TOO EXPOSED/IS NOT EXPOSED ENOUGH, SNIPEFEST, TOO MUCH GREEN/ BLOOM. YOU RUINED IT HIREZ
Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:46 pm

AnEskimo Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 1:37 am Posts: 555	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 Thanks for the new map, can't wait to see it.
Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:46 pm

Andur Beta Tester Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 7:35 pm Posts: 5836 Location: Spain	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 Humm. I think you imply that, if a player wants to get a bug fixed, they have to do all that additional work on their own (I'm talking about double-hitting mines and FRAPSing the issue). Most players don't report bugs at all. It's not their job. Players want to play. You should be thankful of what feedback you do have, so that a PAID QA can reproduce it. You can ask lots of additional info from users of a free opensource project, but when it comes to a commercial closed source product, THE DEVELOPER has the burden of detecting, reproducing, and in-house fixing bugs. Customers helping with some of this steps should be a bonus, not a requirement. You can't blame users when a bug stays on the live build for months. You can't require user input on your bughunting workflow. For example, if I tell you that a mininuke just insta-exploded on top of 8 Vandal IIIs, you can't expect me to reproduce it. QA has the tools to do that on a controlled environment, or at least they should. TL;DR Be more proactive with bug hunting, don't just react to detailed user reports.
Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:50 pm

Sansa Beta Tester Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:37 pm Posts: 4237	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 Andur wrote: Humm. I think you imply that, if a player wants to get a bug fixed, they have to do all that additional work on their own (I'm talking about double-hitting mines and FRAPSing the issue). Most players don't report bugs at all. It's not their job. Players want to play. You should be thankful of what feedback you do have, so that a PAID QA can reproduce it. You can ask lots of additional info from users of a free opensource project, but when it comes to a commercial closed source product, THE DEVELOPER has the burden of detecting, reproducing, and in-house fixing bugs. Customers helping with some of this steps should be a bonus, not a requirement. You can't blame users when a bug stays on the live build for months. You can't require user input on your bughunting workflow. For example, if I tell you that a mininuke just insta-exploded on top of 8 Vandal IIIs, you can't expect me to reproduce it. QA has the tools to do that on a controlled environment, or at least they should. TL;DR Be more proactive with bug hunting, don't just react to detailed user reports. I kinda agree with this. I don't mind testing stuff and giving feedback to help out, but there have been several times where it has felt like a chore/burden, when the point of buying a game is to have fun and let the people getting paid work out the bug fixes after they are reported.
Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:55 pm

HiRezDuke Hi-Rez Team Member Joined: Thu Jul 15, 2010 1:07 pm Posts: 5244 Location: Hi-Rez	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 Andur wrote: Humm. I think you imply that, if a player wants to get a bug fixed, they have to do all that additional work on their own (I'm talking about double-hitting mines and FRAPSing the issue). Most players don't report bugs at all. It's not their job. Players want to play. You should be thankful of what feedback you do have, so that a PAID QA can reproduce it. You can ask lots of additional info from users of a free opensource project, but when it comes to a commercial closed source product, THE DEVELOPER has the burden of detecting, reproducing, and in-house fixing bugs. Customers helping with some of this steps should be a bonus, not a requirement. You can't blame users when a bug stays on the live build for months. You can't require user input on your bughunting workflow. For example, if I tell you that a mininuke just insta-exploded on top of 8 Vandal IIIs, you can't expect me to reproduce it. QA has the tools to do that on a controlled environment, or at least they should. TL;DR Be more proactive with bug hunting, don't just react to detailed user reports. QA tried to reproduce it multiple times with no actual information. I didn't blame users. I said it was unable to be reproduced in-house with the limited information of FIX DOUBLE HIT MINES. For the sake of sensible conversation, it's best to reply to what I said instead of making up something that I didn't say or even imply. Additionally, you just gave an apples-to-oranges comparison with your mininuke comment. You gave details. We literally had no solid information to continue the pursuit of this issue until this week.
Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:10 pm

Randmer Beta Tester Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:12 pm Posts: 1895 Location: Moscow, Russia Steam Gamer Name: Plukh	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 It could be incredibly difficult to reproduce a bug in controlled conditions - I can tell about, probably, 10+ cases where I'd quite literally banged my head on the table trying to reproduce an issue my clients were having . So while I do agree that we're playing the game for fun, and that we, as paying customers, don't have to try and find ways to reproduce bugs, my developer side tells me that helping the devs would be greatly appreciated and would, in the end, be in my own best interests . _________________ A more fun Defense Raid proposal Replace Perfect Target with Reverse Fission Bomb
Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:16 pm

Goob Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2010 3:32 pm Posts: 2138	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 Randmer wrote: It could be incredibly difficult to reproduce a bug in controlled conditions - I can tell about, probably, 10+ cases where I'd quite literally banged my head on the table trying to reproduce an issue my clients were having :-(. So while I do agree that we're playing the game for fun, and that we, as paying customers, don't have to try and find ways to reproduce bugs, my developer side tells me that helping the devs would be greatly appreciated and would, in the end, be in my own best interests :-). Bingo. Just a reminder, the more people who log on to the test server and test new patches, the fewer[] of these bugs will make it into the live servers. [] I said fewer, it'd be next to impossible to eliminate all.
Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:20 pm

Antitso Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2010 5:28 pm Posts: 326	Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1 Duke your getting a little more hot headed in every post I see of yours You need to pull back a bit, be calm and be a bit more professional. Your roll of a dev doesn't involve sarcasm and insulting, that's for us to do. _________________ Last edited by Antitso on Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Fri Dec 10, 2010 9:41 pm

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Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

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Message

Anubins

Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:35 am
Posts: 43
Location: United Kingdom
Steam Gamer Name: [BLUF]Syph

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

Honestly, I think HR is doing a pretty bang up job with patches recently. My internet admittedly isn't great so takes some time downloading the updates in the first place, but I had a large file to download last update, and this one is 6000MB, rounded.

Sure, it's one thing to say that quality of content is better than size, but if you ask me? There's got to be at least something in here.

Just one British bloke's opinion, but, hey.

_________________
I'm Commander Shepard, and this is my favourite post on the extranet.

Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:30 pm

Sansa

Beta Tester

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:37 pm
Posts: 4237

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

Baharroth wrote:

Finally, weapons on the AH, good to see.

Sansa wrote:

So basically it's the other PvP map added, but flair doesn't start until the 15th?

Oh come on! Map first! Besides, let it get closer to Christmas...

I'm not mad or anything, I just thought there was flair today but there wasn't. Logged in, found out no flair, logged out to do stuff, now gonna log back in lol.

Edit: I should have said 'and' instead of 'but' so it didn't sound negative.

Edit2: I realize the patch is more than those things. I'm sick today, critical thinking skills are nonexistent.

Last edited by Sansa on Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:44 pm

HiRezKate

Hi-Rez Team Member

Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2010 4:00 pm
Posts: 790
Location: Dome City

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

Sansa wrote:

Baharroth wrote:

Finally, weapons on the AH, good to see.

Sansa wrote:

So basically it's the other PvP map added, but flair doesn't start until the 15th?

Oh come on! Map first! Besides, let it get closer to Christmas...

We'll let ya know when the Christmas stuff launches, Sansa =)

_________________

MagiCandyBar wrote:

Soon.™

blackchimes wrote:

WORST MAP EVER, TOO SMALL/TOO BIG, THE HILLS ARE NOT HIGH ENOUGH/THE HILLS ARE TOO HIGH, THE FLAG IS TOO EXPOSED/IS NOT EXPOSED ENOUGH, SNIPEFEST, TOO MUCH GREEN/ BLOOM. YOU RUINED IT HIREZ

Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:46 pm

AnEskimo

Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 1:37 am
Posts: 555

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

Thanks for the new map, can't wait to see it.

Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:46 pm

Andur

Beta Tester

Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 7:35 pm
Posts: 5836
Location: Spain

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

Humm. I think you imply that, if a player wants to get a bug fixed, they have to do all that additional work on their own (I'm talking about double-hitting mines and FRAPSing the issue).

Most players don't report bugs at all. It's not their job. Players want to play. You should be thankful of what feedback you do have, so that a PAID QA can reproduce it.

You can ask lots of additional info from users of a free opensource project, but when it comes to a commercial closed source product, THE DEVELOPER has the burden of detecting, reproducing, and in-house fixing bugs. Customers helping with some of this steps should be a bonus, not a requirement.

You can't blame users when a bug stays on the live build for months. You can't require user input on your bughunting workflow. For example, if I tell you that a mininuke just insta-exploded on top of 8 Vandal IIIs, you can't expect me to reproduce it. QA has the tools to do that on a controlled environment, or at least they should.

TL;DR Be more proactive with bug hunting, don't just react to detailed user reports.

Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:50 pm

Sansa

Beta Tester

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:37 pm
Posts: 4237

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

Andur wrote:

I kinda agree with this. I don't mind testing stuff and giving feedback to help out, but there have been several times where it has felt like a chore/burden, when the point of buying a game is to have fun and let the people getting paid work out the bug fixes after they are reported.

Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:55 pm

HiRezDuke

Hi-Rez Team Member

Joined: Thu Jul 15, 2010 1:07 pm
Posts: 5244
Location: Hi-Rez

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

Andur wrote:

QA tried to reproduce it multiple times with no actual information.

I didn't blame users. I said it was unable to be reproduced in-house with the limited information of FIX DOUBLE HIT MINES. For the sake of sensible conversation, it's best to reply to what I said instead of making up something that I didn't say or even imply.

Additionally, you just gave an apples-to-oranges comparison with your mininuke comment. You gave details. We literally had no solid information to continue the pursuit of this issue until this week.

Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:10 pm

Randmer

Beta Tester

Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:12 pm
Posts: 1895
Location: Moscow, Russia
Steam Gamer Name: Plukh

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

. So while I do agree that we're playing the game for fun, and that we, as paying customers, don't have to try and find ways to reproduce bugs, my developer side tells me that helping the devs would be greatly appreciated and would, in the end, be in my own best interests :-)

_________________
A more fun Defense Raid proposal
Replace Perfect Target with Reverse Fission Bomb

Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:16 pm

Goob

Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2010 3:32 pm
Posts: 2138

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

Randmer wrote:

It could be incredibly difficult to reproduce a bug in controlled conditions - I can tell about, probably, 10+ cases where I'd quite literally banged my head on the table trying to reproduce an issue my clients were having :-(. So while I do agree that we're playing the game for fun, and that we, as paying customers, don't have to try and find ways to reproduce bugs, my developer side tells me that helping the devs would be greatly appreciated and would, in the end, be in my own best interests :-).

Bingo.

Just a reminder, the more people who log on to the test server and test new patches, the fewer[*] of these bugs will make it into the live servers.

[*] I said fewer, it'd be next to impossible to eliminate all.

Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:20 pm

Antitso

Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2010 5:28 pm
Posts: 326

Re: Patch Notes: December 10, 2010 - VERSION 1.39.1

Duke your getting a little more hot headed in every post I see of yours

You need to pull back a bit, be calm and be a bit more professional. Your roll of a dev doesn't involve sarcasm and insulting, that's for us to do.

_________________

Last edited by Antitso on Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Fri Dec 10, 2010 9:41 pm